OK Jeff,
I apologize again and again, and i already felt really really bad
before you even wrote this. And thank you for crushing whats left
of me.

I think I need to put things in perspective here. First of all i didn't do
research on these fish to put them in a large enough tank. I bought the
tank (220gallon) because i intended on getting more goldfish which in
the end, i didn't do. I did do a a full day of research at the redevilfish
site
you mention below and a few more before I bought the fish, so it wasn't an
impulsive thing. It's my first time keeping Cichlids, and contrary to what
you
said, i've only been on this newsgroup for 2 weeks not months, and i missed
the thread you mentioned so gimme a break ok?

These Red Devils all six of them were at the LFS in a 40 gallon tank with
15 blood parrots. I got all six of them for 30$CDN, and i felt like i would
be
saving them in my big 220gallon tank. I had no idea that these BS products
don't work, I paid alot for that stuff, and I injected it straight into the
filter
intake the recommended amount for 220gallon on two seperate occasions.
This so it wouldn't get diluted as you say. I told the guy at the LFS that
my tank
wasn't cycled yet and i wanted to take the fish only a few at a time till it
cycled,
but he said he wouldn't keep them for longer than a few days, and then he
assured
me that the Biozyme would work fine, and that the water changes would be
alright
and also that these fish were very tough in compromised water conditions and
especially
for the extra large tank, they would not suffer. So yes, i did expect
magical things,
gross mistake on my part.

I was gonna jump start the filter with my Goldfish filter sponge, but i was
afraid these fish
might be sensitive to Goldfish Parasites, so i opted to go the BS route. How
was I suppose to
know it wouldn't work?

Anyhow, turns out it may not be so bad, my nitrite kit tops out at 3ppm
(really sensitive), and
it seems the tester was a shade under that last night so i estimate Nitrite
to be 2-3ppm.
After the 25% water the fish reacted very positively and were all swimming
around this morning,
and eating fine. I will stop the feeding for a few days as Cichlidiot
recommended. I liked his post
alot better, he seemed more sympathetic to my cause.

I'm doing a 50% water right now. They are swimming around and seem very
happy again.
The water is aged with an airstone in big 55 gallon plastic vats
for 24 hours, and preheated to the tank temperature 78degF. Then I treat it
with a good shot of
dechlorinator anyhow and add de-stressing liquid for the fish. If they get
violent with each other
in the future I also have a 90 gallon on stanby and two more Qtine 55 gallon
Vats with filtration.

You see, i care for my fish. Do I get your pardon or you still ****ed at me?

....Kodiak


"Jeff Dantzler" wrote in message
news:1075219606.716354@yasure...
Kodiak wrote:
Biozyme? Has anyone out there tried "Cycle" ?
The fish are now sitting on the bottom of the tank, not moving is that
bad?
They are not at the surface gasping for air, is this a good sign?
Am I gonna lose my fish? Is the Nitrite spike just as bad on the fish
as the Ammo spike? Will there be permanant damage or brown blood disease
etc? I have a 0.1% salt solution, and a Huge 6" airstone with a big air
pump,
will this help? I'm gonna do another 30% water tomorrow, is there
anything
else i should do?

Kodiak, why did you think you could just chuck a bunch of red devils
into a brand new tank? These "Biozyme" or "Biospira" products are just
BS gimmicks designed to take your money. It's a *lot* cheaper to buy
a liter of pure (as in no detergents or fragrances) household cleaning
ammonia and a handfull of gravel or filter media to jumpstart a proper
biofilter. Think about it: the sponges and media in your AC500's were
_barren_ of any bacteria when you threw your livestock in. You diluted
a BS product into 200+ gallons and expected the sponges to be magically
colonized with beneficial bacteria? Much easier to borrow some used
filter media or gravel and place it directly in your filter upstream
of your virgin media.

Look up "fishless cycling" in the archives.

You poisoned your fish! They may or may not recover. What a shame to
do to such an awesome fish as a red devil. I've got a show quality
specimen about 7" long in a 100 gallon tank. I never subjected him
to a toxic cocktail of ammonia and nitrite though. You don't drink out
of those yellow, kiddy wading pools right--why ask your prized fish
to put up with that?

At the very least you should have cycled your tank with some danios
instead of the cichlids you wished to keep. The red devils would have
eaten them eventually.

I admire that you did enough research to put these fish in a large
enough tank. Take my advice and make sure that your new tanks have
zero ammonia and zero nitrite before you add your cichlids in the
future.

Might I also suggest that you read:
http://www.cichlidae.com/articles/a106.html
which will give you some more info on these fish.
as will
http://www.reddevilfish.co.uk/index.htm

If your fish survive and are not too damaged, they may breed
in this tank. You'll need to manage them carefully, or expect a few
of them to meet a violent end.

Sorry if I seem like I'm ranting--but I get real tired of hearing
about people abusing their cichlids by using them to "cycle" their
tank.

You've been around in this group a while. Did you not learn anything
from this thread earlier this month?

"Our Cichlids - their short tragic history"

http://www.google.com/groups?dq=&hl=...-8&threadm=Xns
946CF2B49C689rrwi94555%4024.94.170.87&prev=/groups%3Fdq%3D%26num%3D50%26
hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3DUTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26group%3Drec.aquaria.
freshwater.cichlids%26scoring%3Dd%26start%3D50

Cheers all.

Jeff Dantzler