On Sun, 24 Oct 2004, dreas wrote:

> > The conversation wasn't about '80s Caravelles, which are M-bodies, but
> > about '70s Caravelles, which are F-bodies. The M-bodies were *greatly*
> > improved in corrosion resistance compared to their M-body progenitors.
>
> Now I'm good and confused.

My fault for making a thoroughly unclear comment about F vs. M bodies and
completely omitting the K-car derivative Caravelles.

The Diplomat, LeBaron and Canadian Caravelle were introduced in the late
1970s (1977, 1977 and 1978, respectively) as upmarket versions of the
F-bodies (Aspen and Volare). Don't remember when the Plymouth Gran Fury
got badge-engineered into existence from a Diplomat. Sheetmetal changes
relative to the Aspen/Volare were EXTREMELY limited...basically new front
and rear header panels and slightly reshaped hoods and trunks on the
4-doors. The rest of the exterior differences involved schtuff like landau
roofs with opera lights, chrome trim, phony wire wheel covers, ornaments,
badges, etc. For most intents and purposes, the only significant
difference between an "F-body" and an "M-body" was the designation -- it
was only four years earlier that most sheetmetal would not interchange
between same-year Dodge Darts and Plymouth Valiants, both A-bodies!

The F-bodies (Aspen, Volare) went away after the 1981 model year, and the
M-bodies continued their slow and very limited evolution. Rustproofing got
much better, and there were some sheetmetal changes, but the undercar
stuff (suspension, etc.) as well as the doors(!) remained interchangeable
with F-body items. This was true until the last little styling change in
'87 slightly modified the windowframe shape of the rear doors.

> Are you saying that there was a Caravelle with a Volare/Aspen type body?

All the early Caravelles had a "Volare/Aspen type body" with the same
minor differences that set a Diplomat apart from an Aspen.

> what about those FWD 80's Caravelles that look like slightly enlarged
> K-cars, resembling Chrysler E-class cars?

Yep, Plymouth Caravelle - Dodge 600 - Chrysler E-class. What about them?

> Let's not get started on all the different things that were called New
> Yorker from 1980 to 1990.

Oh, no, let's! There was the M-body Chrysler New Yorker Fifth Avenue (not
to be confused with the K-car derivative or the AC-body introduced in '89
or so as a rebadged Dodge Die-nasty.