goldfish sick

I had problems with my guppy tank & betta tanks with ick, which is now under
control and they all look almost 100% better, but I think in the process of
doing water changes and feeding and what not I may have used something in my
big tank that I had used in one of those tanks when they were sick, not sure
what I used...... but something, so anyway I have a tank with a blue
gourami, a goldfish, 2 African dwarf frogs and a pleco. the goldfish and
gourami have been living together for two years now, have had no prior
problems in that tank, I added the African dwarf frogs and pleco about two
weeks ago, (I am aware of the fact these are not fish that should be
together but since they having been together so long I just kept them like
that)
Anyway a few days back I noticed my goldfish who is very big, I got him as a
feeder and he is now bigger then the fish in my neighbors pond, was not
looking good, his tailfin was not moving and seemed stiff or clamped ? his
top fins were laying down flat, and his swimming was a bit off, the other
fish seemed fine, the next day I noticed ick on the gourami and as I looked
close at the goldfish I seen a few spots, but he looked sick, were the
gourami was acting fine still, being more worried about the goldfish I
started looking info up on how to treat him, every thing I read said
something different, so I took ten level tablespoons to a gallon of water
and did a dip every 12 hours, and started treating the tank with rid ick+, I
had to remove the African dwarf frogs because of the meds, but any way, I
noticed a big difference in the first day, before I started he looked like
he would be dead with in a day, after he started eating, his fins were back
to moving, I am only on the second day, so I am hoping he stays on the same
course, and gets better, what I am wondering about is, ick goes in a cycle
right?? I know warm temp will speed it up in my guppy tank I had put the
temp on 82, but the goldfish don't like warm, so does that mean it will take
longer to treat the ick, and how much ick med can the pleco take from what I
understand they have a hard time with ick meds.
thanks nikki

Nikki wrote:
I had problems with my guppy tank & betta tanks with ick, which is now under
control and they all look almost 100% better, but I think in the process of
doing water changes and feeding and what not I may have used something in my
big tank that I had used in one of those tanks when they were sick, not sure
what I used...... but something, so anyway I have a tank with a blue
gourami, a goldfish, 2 African dwarf frogs and a pleco. the goldfish and
gourami have been living together for two years now, have had no prior
problems in that tank, I added the African dwarf frogs and pleco about two
weeks ago, (I am aware of the fact these are not fish that should be
together but since they having been together so long I just kept them like
that)
Anyway a few days back I noticed my goldfish who is very big, I got him as a
feeder and he is now bigger then the fish in my neighbors pond, was not
looking good, his tailfin was not moving and seemed stiff or clamped ? his
top fins were laying down flat, and his swimming was a bit off, the other
fish seemed fine, the next day I noticed ick on the gourami and as I looked
close at the goldfish I seen a few spots, but he looked sick, were the
gourami was acting fine still, being more worried about the goldfish I
started looking info up on how to treat him, every thing I read said
something different, so I took ten level tablespoons to a gallon of water
and did a dip every 12 hours, and started treating the tank with rid ick+, I
had to remove the African dwarf frogs because of the meds, but any way, I
noticed a big difference in the first day, before I started he looked like
he would be dead with in a day, after he started eating, his fins were back
to moving, I am only on the second day, so I am hoping he stays on the same
course, and gets better, what I am wondering about is, ick goes in a cycle
right?? I know warm temp will speed it up in my guppy tank I had put the
temp on 82, but the goldfish don't like warm, so does that mean it will take
longer to treat the ick, and how much ick med can the pleco take from what I
understand they have a hard time with ick meds.
thanks nikki

Oh, no! That's terrible news. I'm glad your goldfish is looking
better. Sounds like the salt dip is the right thing to do.

For more info on the lifecycle of ich, check out
http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/docs/health/ich.shtml

High temperatures don't bother goldfish as much as the lower amounts of
oxygen in the water. Mine were up to 85F in the pond this past summer,
but there's a lot of surface area and splash there. As you heat up the
goldfish, start an airstone and watch for signs of low oxygen - gilling
hard, hanging out at the surface, or not moving as much.

The pleco should be fine with a half dose of ich medicine.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

Nikki wrote,
so I took ten level tablespoons to a gallon of water
and did a dip every 12 hours........

Likely striped it's slime coat and along with it any parasites that had
not yet got through the skin. Medication will not kill the ich
parasites already inbedded into the skin.

and started treating the tank with rid ick+ ............

Because of the pleco, treat half dose. I treat days 1, 4, 7, and 10,
with a 20% water change with gravel vac before each dose. Being that
your treating half dose, you may have to treat day 13 also...
Rid-Ich contains formalin and malachite green. Malachite green is
really hard on catfish, scaleless fish, and tetras. Higher temps. and
lower pH makes it more toxic. Goldfish are coolwater fish. Raising the
temp. would only raise the stress level of a coolwater fish - the
medication alone will kill the parasites. It would be better for both
the pleco and goldfish *not* to raise the temp... Malachite Green also
remains within tissue for a long time, so repeated treatments causes
accumulation to toxic levels. The toxicity within fish presents as
respiratory distress. You didn't say if there was ich on the pleco - if
not, remove it *before* the 3 treatment.
Dim aquarium lights, or turn them off - malachite green is degraded by
light... Oxygen levels drop with the use of formalin - another reason
not to raise the temp........... Frank

Ok, first I wanted to wait to update till I was sure what was going on, I
had already treated day 1 and 2 with ick med, I had not read this yet, so I
skipped last night, I looked at the pleco this morning I don't see ick on
him but I would be afraid to put him in one of my other tanks just incase, I
don't see ick on the gourami either but its hard to tell on him, i'm sure he
did have it, the gold fish does look better he is swimming around, his tail
is not clamped, fins are back up and moving, but I keep looking at his head,
when I first look I thought oh no fungus, but I'm not sure, it just looks
like a little white on his coat, but it don't look like fungus which my
guppies had, I am going to just watch it right now.
I don't know, any one have any idea if I should continue with salt dips or
hold off now, i dont want to over do it, and if not how often should I do
them, he does look like he is getting better, he is a pretty big boy, so I
think that has been in his favor. Since i did ick med on day 1 and 2, what
now
Nikki




"Frank" wrote in message
oups.com...
Nikki wrote,
so I took ten level tablespoons to a gallon of water
and did a dip every 12 hours........

Likely striped it's slime coat and along with it any parasites that had
not yet got through the skin. Medication will not kill the ich
parasites already inbedded into the skin.

and started treating the tank with rid ick+ ............

Because of the pleco, treat half dose. I treat days 1, 4, 7, and 10,
with a 20% water change with gravel vac before each dose. Being that
your treating half dose, you may have to treat day 13 also...
Rid-Ich contains formalin and malachite green. Malachite green is
really hard on catfish, scaleless fish, and tetras. Higher temps. and
lower pH makes it more toxic. Goldfish are coolwater fish. Raising the
temp. would only raise the stress level of a coolwater fish - the
medication alone will kill the parasites. It would be better for both
the pleco and goldfish *not* to raise the temp... Malachite Green also
remains within tissue for a long time, so repeated treatments causes
accumulation to toxic levels. The toxicity within fish presents as
respiratory distress. You didn't say if there was ich on the pleco - if
not, remove it *before* the 3 treatment.
Dim aquarium lights, or turn them off - malachite green is degraded by
light... Oxygen levels drop with the use of formalin - another reason
not to raise the temp........... Frank

Nikki wrote,
I don't know, any one have any idea if I should continue with salt dips or
hold off now...........

I would hold off. One tsb of salt per gal. in the tank will stimulate
it's slime coat. Their slime coat contains antibody, so you won't want
to strip it - give it a little time to heal.

Since i did ick med on day 1 and 2, what
now .....

You don't want to over do that eather. Malachite green remains within
tissue for a long time, so it's not like the med. stops working when
you stop adding it. Next treatment should still be on day 4 (with a 20%
water change before treatment). If you plan on leaving the pleco in
there, keep an eye on it. If it looks like it is going into respiratory
distress, it will have to be moved to an untreated tank.
................. Frank

On 14 Mar 2006 07:14:19 -0800, "Frank"
wrote:

Nikki wrote,
I don't know, any one have any idea if I should continue with salt dips or
hold off now...........

I would hold off. One tsb of salt per gal. in the tank will stimulate
it's slime coat. Their slime coat contains antibody, so you won't want
to strip it - give it a little time to heal.

Since i did ick med on day 1 and 2, what
now .....

You don't want to over do that eather. Malachite green remains within
tissue for a long time, so it's not like the med. stops working when
you stop adding it. Next treatment should still be on day 4 (with a 20%
water change before treatment). If you plan on leaving the pleco in
there, keep an eye on it. If it looks like it is going into respiratory
distress, it will have to be moved to an untreated tank.
................ Frank

I might add, when I find myself looking around for where to house a
fish temporarily and come up empty, I head for my local Tru Valu
hardware store and find a big no-name Tupperware container, there's
one with two red flaps on top that holds around 12 gallons that I just
love, for around 5 bucks. A lot of fry have grown up in those things.

-- Mister Gardener

I looked at all three of them a few minutes ago, the pleco has been out more
now because I have kept the light off, he is usually upside down on a big
rock somewhere, now he is on the glass so I was able to check him better, I
used a magnified glass, he looks fine to me I see nothing on him, the
gourami I think may have a couple ick spots (like a grain of salt) on his
side fins, but I am not 100% sure, the goldfish I don't see no ick on now,
but like I said his tail looks a little (hard to describe) white on the very
tips and I don't see any of the white on his coat like I seen before.
I thought I read that the salt would hurt the pleco, which is why I was
doing the salt dips out side of the tank in a bucket for the goldfish, am I
correct in thinking salt is bad for the pleco or could he deal with the
teaspoon per gallon, and how about the gourami, can he also deal with salt?
oh one question if anyone knows, my LFS does not have salt for fishtanks,
but I have the Morton's non-iodized salt which is what I use, I also have
salt I got at the store its called (Reese seasalt, it says fine crystals,
all natural, no additives, the ingredients are : refined sea salt.... that's
all) Any idea if that is better then the non-iodized table salt, at least
till I can find aquarium salt?? Thanks
I am not sure if the stuff on the goldfish I said I seen is fungus or
anything for that matter but while I was out today I grabbed T.C capsules
(antibiotic) incase in the end he does have some type of fungus, which is
what happened after getting rid of the ick in my guppy tank.
and if not I'll have them for if I ever need them.
thank you guys so much, the last few weeks I have just had a mess with my
tanks, and I do appreciate all the help. I also cut down on feeding I
usually feed twice a day, I try to feed different things, I got the jar of
food that has four different types of food breakfast/ lunch/ dinner/ snack
Nikki


"Frank" wrote in message
ups.com...
Nikki wrote,
I don't know, any one have any idea if I should continue with salt dips or
hold off now...........

I would hold off. One tsb of salt per gal. in the tank will stimulate
it's slime coat. Their slime coat contains antibody, so you won't want
to strip it - give it a little time to heal.

Since i did ick med on day 1 and 2, what
now .....

You don't want to over do that eather. Malachite green remains within
tissue for a long time, so it's not like the med. stops working when
you stop adding it. Next treatment should still be on day 4 (with a 20%
water change before treatment). If you plan on leaving the pleco in
there, keep an eye on it. If it looks like it is going into respiratory
distress, it will have to be moved to an untreated tank.
................ Frank

There is no such thing as a "tsb"!! I would think one would try to give
very accurate clear info in a case like this...

Do you mean?
A. tsp (teaspoon)
B. Tbs (Tablespoon)

Karl.

Frank wrote:
I would hold off. One tsb of salt per gal.
................ Frank

hondaru wrote,
There is no such thing as a "tsb"!! I would think one would try to give
very accurate clear info in a case like this...
Do you mean?
A. tsp (teaspoon)
B. Tbs (Tablespoon)

Teaspoon - sometimes my typing finger has a mind of it's own, other
times I just misspell ;-) ........... Frank

I knew what you were saying (teaspoon), I got a bottle of peroxide and will
start doing that tonight, he is still looking pretty good (goldfish), I
might have to start going back to their normal feeding schedule, he is
getting snippy with me, I was just figuring since I was having problems it
might help to cut back on the food, the goldfish and gourami do get fed more
then the rest, the guppies and bettas I don't feed as often. The pleco will
be going to the 120 gallon as soon as it is set up, I keep telling my
husband to wait, (having nightmares of it going through my floor) I thought
about putting my African dwarf frogs in with one of my betta's, I have read
people have done it, and others say no, but I would like to give the
goldfish and gourami their tank back to them selves, before putting the
others in that tank, they were in there for two years and never got sick or
had any problems.
Nikki
Hey thanks for the help, I really appreciate it




"Frank" wrote in message
oups.com...
hondaru wrote,
There is no such thing as a "tsb"!! I would think one would try to give
very accurate clear info in a case like this...
Do you mean?
A. tsp (teaspoon)
B. Tbs (Tablespoon)

Teaspoon - sometimes my typing finger has a mind of it's own, other
times I just misspell ;-) ........... Frank