AVERAGE LIFE OF YELLOW TANG - UPDATE

I didn't realize my question would spark such a controversy!

Here is an update.:
My tank ( 75 gallon FO) is quite near the water meter into the house. I have
a Fluke Digital VOM used for work. Model 12 -- pretty good unit. I measured
the AC voltage from the copper inlet pipe to the tank water -- by sticking
the probe into the water. Was I surprised. I measured 48 VOLTS AC !!!! I
then began unplugging equipment. First the heater. - dropped 6 volts to 42
VAC. Next the UV - Dropped 2 more volts. Then the Empereor 400 dropped
another 2 volts. Then the Flouresent lamp dropped 2 more volts. Then the
Eheim filter -- another 2 volts. Then the skimmer another 2 volts. When
EVERYTHING was unplugged - I still had a reading of 32 Volts AC. I put the
ground probe in the water attached to the water line. Voltage went to .009
Volts AC. I watched the fish to see if proximity to the probe changed their
behavior - Nope. I reconnected everyhing and the voltage went to .011 VAC.
That's an increase of only 2 millivolts. I'm going to keep the ground probe
in the tank and see if the LLE on the Tang begins to reverse. I'll post my
results.
( I'll also be very careful not to drop anything in the water !)

Russ

--
Russell Jankowski


A.M. SERVICE
440-333-4923

Mr. Jankowski, how about measuring the CURRENT instead of the VOLTAGE?

If you do not have connection to ground you WILL NOT FEEL the voltage.

Have you ever observed birds sitting on a high voltage power lines?
They do not care about the voltage to ground when they do not touch
the ground. The same is with your fish: they do not care about the
voltage between the water and your copper pipes BECAUSE THEY DO NOT
TOUCH THE COPPER PIPES.

If you were able to attach your voltmeter between the bird's wing
and the ground you would measure thousands of volts. Would you consider
a good idea to connect the wire between its wing and ground to "neutralize"
the voltage? Think about it... what current would flow from bird's legs
to its wings after you connect your "birds grounding probe"? :-))

As stated by P but differently:
The average difference of potential between a persons feet and head is 500
volts.
But there is no current to go with that potential.

One of the coolest experiments I did when I was first learning about such
things is suspend a wire 5 feet in the air insulated at both ends. Then
ground it through a 10 megaohm resistor and measure the voltage. (To prove
the previous statement)

Same holds true with the tank UNLESS there is a damaged component.
In that case, the said tank components had BETTER be connected to a GFCI!

Otherwise, a failure can boil your tank!

As for the health benefits, I think it is like wearing a magnetic bracelet
to cure carpel tunnel syndrome.

The grounding probe is for safety when used with a GFCI only..

IMHO
CW

"Pszemol" wrote in message
...
Mr. Jankowski, how about measuring the CURRENT instead of the VOLTAGE?

If you do not have connection to ground you WILL NOT FEEL the voltage.

Have you ever observed birds sitting on a high voltage power lines?
They do not care about the voltage to ground when they do not touch
the ground. The same is with your fish: they do not care about the
voltage between the water and your copper pipes BECAUSE THEY DO NOT
TOUCH THE COPPER PIPES.
If you were able to attach your voltmeter between the bird's wing
and the ground you would measure thousands of volts. Would you consider
a good idea to connect the wire between its wing and ground to
"neutralize"
the voltage? Think about it... what current would flow from bird's legs
to its wings after you connect your "birds grounding probe"? :-))

Thanks,

I am installing a GFCI this weekend. I will then see what measurments I get.
Should have done this anyway - being around water.

"Russ J." wrote in message . ..
I am installing a GFCI this weekend.
I will then see what measurments I get.

I do not expect GFCI doing any miracles with your measurments.

"Pszemol" wrote in message
...
"Russ J." wrote in message
. ..
I am installing a GFCI this weekend.
I will then see what measurments I get.

I do not expect GFCI doing any miracles with your measurments.

A GFCI monitors the amount of current flowing from hot to neutral. If there is
any imbalance, it trips the circuit. It is able to sense a mismatch as small as
4 or 5 milliamps, and it can react as quickly as one-thirtieth of a second. It
will prevent the tank from going "live". If any appliances are leaking current,
it will let you know, and won't let the voltage flow again until the problem is
fixed. Anyone not using them is asking for trouble. In many cities, they are
now required in bathrooms or anywhere where there are live wires and water.
Once enough aquarium enthusiasts get zapped, expect regulations to change for
this industry as well.

"Russ J." wrote in message
. ..
Thanks,

I am installing a GFCI this weekend. I will then see what measurments I get.
Should have done this anyway - being around water.


Good luck. It really is the proper thing to do. Your fish will thank you for
it. And it will make working around the tank much safer.

"Russ J." wrote:

I didn't realize my question would spark such a controversy!

Here is an update.:
My tank ( 75 gallon FO) is quite near the water meter into the house. I have
a Fluke Digital VOM used for work. Model 12 -- pretty good unit. I measured
the AC voltage from the copper inlet pipe to the tank water -- by sticking
the probe into the water. Was I surprised. I measured 48 VOLTS AC !!!! I
then began unplugging equipment. First the heater. - dropped 6 volts to 42
VAC. Next the UV - Dropped 2 more volts. Then the Empereor 400 dropped
another 2 volts. Then the Flouresent lamp dropped 2 more volts. Then the
Eheim filter -- another 2 volts. Then the skimmer another 2 volts. When
EVERYTHING was unplugged - I still had a reading of 32 Volts AC. I put the
ground probe in the water attached to the water line. Voltage went to .009
Volts AC. I watched the fish to see if proximity to the probe changed their
behavior - Nope. I reconnected everyhing and the voltage went to .011 VAC.
That's an increase of only 2 millivolts. I'm going to keep the ground probe
in the tank and see if the LLE on the Tang begins to reverse. I'll post my
results.
( I'll also be very careful not to drop anything in the water !)

Russ

Digital meters are notorious for detecting stray voltages that
have no appreciable current flow producing ability. Try
re-reading with a cheep analog meter (I keep one taped to the
back of my Fluke

Paul

Well, I didn't get the GFI in this weekend ! Mother's day and other things.
I would be curious if any of the group tried the same measurments with a
digial meter.

The place I grabbed the ground was at the INPUT to my main water meter. (
this should be connected directly undergound to the street feed. I don't
think I have a better place to connect it. No 8 foot ground stakes.

I'll post my results when I get the GFCI installed. I agree with George that
if a small amount of current was flowing to ground the GFCI would probably
trip. Yes I could have the high voltage because of a sensitive Digital VOM -
it's a FLUKE 12. I'll see if I can borrow a cheap analog and try the
measurements Before I put in the GFCI.
Russ


"pausto" wrote in message
...
"Russ J." wrote:

I didn't realize my question would spark such a controversy!

Here is an update.:
My tank ( 75 gallon FO) is quite near the water meter into the house. I
have
a Fluke Digital VOM used for work. Model 12 -- pretty good unit. I
measured
the AC voltage from the copper inlet pipe to the tank water -- by
sticking
the probe into the water. Was I surprised. I measured 48 VOLTS AC !!!! I
then began unplugging equipment. First the heater. - dropped 6 volts to
42
VAC. Next the UV - Dropped 2 more volts. Then the Empereor 400 dropped
another 2 volts. Then the Flouresent lamp dropped 2 more volts. Then the
Eheim filter -- another 2 volts. Then the skimmer another 2 volts. When
EVERYTHING was unplugged - I still had a reading of 32 Volts AC. I put
the
ground probe in the water attached to the water line. Voltage went to
.009
Volts AC. I watched the fish to see if proximity to the probe changed
their
behavior - Nope. I reconnected everyhing and the voltage went to .011
VAC.
That's an increase of only 2 millivolts. I'm going to keep the ground
probe
in the tank and see if the LLE on the Tang begins to reverse. I'll post
my
results.
( I'll also be very careful not to drop anything in the water !)

Russ

Digital meters are notorious for detecting stray voltages that
have no appreciable current flow producing ability. Try
re-reading with a cheep analog meter (I keep one taped to the
back of my Fluke

Paul

George suspected you did not unplugged all devices
and this was the reason for your 32VAC readings...
Can you confirm you are 100% sure you unplugged them all ?

The other method than cheap-o-analog meter would be to
use your meter but bridge it with a 4 kOhm or similar
resistor and repeat your measurements. This would be
your Fluke pretending to be a cheap-o-analog meter
with low internal impedance like they normally are
instead of its normal impedance which goes into tents
or even hundreds of megaohms :-)

Check this out:
http://www.gmc-instruments.com/engli...metrahit1a.htm
This meter has input resistance: 20 kOhm / V=, 4 kOhm / V~
Let me know if you still have 32VAC on a 4kOhm resistor.
This would be something to worry about IMHO...