Stars and Clowns and Anemones, Oh My.

Also a brittle star has a better ability to carry pieces
of food to it's mouth with it's arms via conveyor-line
like method.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



Wayne Sallee wrote on 12/23/2006 4:43 PM:
One is behavior that we were discussing, but also look a the visible
difference. A serpent star is smooth, and a brittle star has lot's of
appendages, and a "green brittle/serpent" is smooth with *some*
appendages, but not nearly as much as a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George wrote on 12/23/2006 4:36 PM:
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
There is a difference between the "green brittle", and what we all
call a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


And that would be? Come on. Out with it, already. :-)

George

"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
ink.net...
One is behavior that we were discussing, but also look a the visible
difference. A serpent star is smooth, and a brittle star has lot's of
appendages, and a "green brittle/serpent" is smooth with *some*
appendages, but not nearly as much as a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


Yes, serpent stars have smooth vertebrae while those of brittle stars are
spiney. So what? They are all in the same family, the difference being at
the level of genera. They are all still brittle stars.

George

George wrote on 12/23/2006 4:36 PM:
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
There is a difference between the "green brittle", and what we all call
a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


And that would be? Come on. Out with it, already. :-)

George

"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
Also a brittle star has a better ability to carry pieces of food to it's
mouth with it's arms via conveyor-line like method.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


Yes, this and the other differences you mention do distinguish one genera
from another. They are still brittle stars.

George


Wayne Sallee wrote on 12/23/2006 4:43 PM:
One is behavior that we were discussing, but also look a the visible
difference. A serpent star is smooth, and a brittle star has lot's of
appendages, and a "green brittle/serpent" is smooth with *some*
appendages, but not nearly as much as a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George wrote on 12/23/2006 4:36 PM:
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
There is a difference between the "green brittle", and what we all
call a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


And that would be? Come on. Out with it, already. :-)

George

And why and how do you think things are classified? Were
the creatures created for the classification, or were the
classifications created for the creatures?

Should we say "It's already been classified, no sense
reclassifying it"?

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George wrote on 12/23/2006 7:48 PM:
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
Also a brittle star has a better ability to carry pieces of food to it's
mouth with it's arms via conveyor-line like method.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


Yes, this and the other differences you mention do distinguish one genera
from another. They are still brittle stars.

George

Wayne Sallee wrote on 12/23/2006 4:43 PM:
One is behavior that we were discussing, but also look a the visible
difference. A serpent star is smooth, and a brittle star has lot's of
appendages, and a "green brittle/serpent" is smooth with *some*
appendages, but not nearly as much as a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George wrote on 12/23/2006 4:36 PM:
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
There is a difference between the "green brittle", and what we all
call a brittle star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets

And that would be? Come on. Out with it, already. :-)

George

"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
nk.net...
And why and how do you think things are classified? Were the creatures
created for the classification, or were the classifications created for
the creatures?

Should we say "It's already been classified, no sense reclassifying it"?

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


The point, Wayne, is that britte stars are considered to be in the class
Ophiuroidea, while starfish are in the class Asteroidea. They are
different classes of echinoderms that likely shared a common ancestry in
the Ordovician. As such, declaring a brittle star and/or a serpent star to
be a type of starfish is like declaring an echinoid to be a sea cucumber,
which, of course, is absurd. Even worse, brittle stars and serpent stars
are in the exact same class. They are simply different genera (akin to the
difference between a chimpanzee and an Orangutan). That said, you are, of
course, free to classify them any way you choose. However, good luck
getting your new classification past peer review.

George

George wrote on 12/24/2006 3:48 AM:
However, good luck
getting your new classification past peer review.

George



Peer review would be this newsgroup:-)
And scientist are reclassifying stuff all the time :-)
And scientists were not the first people to classify :-)

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets

This has been my experience as well. We have two brown/black brittles that
have traversed a couple tank changes with us, and now reside in our 180g
reef. I last measured the largest one about 2 years ago, and it was about
15" from the tip of one leg to the tip of the opposite - no exaggeration.

We've had them both for +/- 7 years, and they have never displayed any
aggression to any tank make, fish, or mobile/sessile invert. Of course, they
do get a chunk of raw seafood from time to time. :-)

Olive green brittles do have a reputation for being somewhat more
aggressive. Note that the term "brittle" and "serpent" star is
interchangeable -- they are all 'Ophiroids". Here is a very good site that
describes these creatures well:

http://home.att.net/~ophiuroid/html/what.html

Chocolate chip starfish (Protoreaster nodosus) are not considered reef
safe - in that they are opportunistic carnivores - they will eat most
anything that can't escape them, including corals,sponges (and probably
anenomes).

~T
http://home.comcast.net/~76fxe


wrote in message
ups.com...

I've always heard the green serpent stars are NOT reef safe. I have a
brown brittle star that has been absolutely fine with my anemones. He
is at least 10 inches across. I've had him for at least 6 months. He
tends to hide most of the time and comes out at feeding times. After
Chip made a play for the anemones he moved on to try to eat the brown
star. Its interesting watching the brittle star "run" around the tank.

I did a quick search for the match to my brown brittle before the
previous post and couldn't find any reference to anything other than
the green serpent star. That is why I posted I was going to head for
the LFS and get a serpent star. When I make the trip Friday I'm going
to try for another brown brittle star. At one time I had about 100
little baby stars crawling in and out of all the cracks in the rocks.
They were awesome to watch. Then I brought home a Green Emperor Goby
and 3 Yellow Tangs. The stars quickly disappeared. I still find a few
hiding in my Fluval canister at cleaning times.

BTW - I would post more scientific names if I new them. I really need
to figure out all I have and keep track of it so I can accurately
describe any issues when they arise.

Wayne Sallee wrote:
There is a green star fish that is often called a brittle
star, and sometimes called a serpent star. It's nature is
like half way between the two. In some ways it's not as
bad as a serpent star, but it is not as good as a brittle
star.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets



George wrote on 12/21/2006 5:18 PM:
"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
news Get a brittle, not a serpent.

Wayne Sallee
Wayne's Pets


Brittle stars will eat anemones as well. At least my green one does,
especially if they aren't doing too well.

George

"Wayne Sallee" wrote in message
ink.net...
George wrote on 12/24/2006 3:48 AM:
However, good luck getting your new classification past peer review.

George

Peer review would be this newsgroup:-)

Peer review? Of a generic reclassification? This newsgroup? Shirley you
jest.

And scientist are reclassifying stuff all the time :-)

Not at that level, not all the time. Not with these critters. They are
too well known. It would take an extraordinary paper to do it.

And scientists were not the first people to classify :-)

Farmer Bob doesn't count.

George