134a Refrigerant

Nathan W. Collier wrote:
> "jeff" > wrote in message
> news:i3Uve.3843$Xr6.3282@trnddc07...
>
>> Service manuals are not the bible. Any reasonably good tech knows that
>>they are only the starting point for thinking.
>
>
> so somehow the atomic weight magically changes? nope.
>
> if you want to use a cloud analogy, look up the atomic weights and provide
> evidence, just as i have done.

Atomic weights? Do you mean the specific gravity of molecular compounds?
Here's a list if you are really interested, but it does not really
address the issue of atmospheric mixing and the process of diffusion.
http://www.burtoncorblin.com/BCTB301.pdf

BTW, O3 (Ozone) has a specific gravity of 1.66. How come there is an
ozone layer if it is "heavier than air"?

I wish I had a nickel for every time I've heard a technician, too lazy
to think for himself, whine the tired old litany "But the manual says....."

--
jeff

That's how I keep score, who dies with the most wins.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
http://www.billhughes.com/

Stephen Cowell wrote:
>
> That lets me know all about him... and why
> you worship him. Thanks!
> __
> Steve
> .

Atomic Table, you know that chart with every element known to man:
http://web.mit.edu/3.091/www/pt/
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
http://www.billhughes.com/

jeff wrote:
>
> Atomic weights? Do you mean the specific gravity of molecular compounds?
> Here's a list if you are really interested, but it does not really
> address the issue of atmospheric mixing and the process of diffusion.
> http://www.burtoncorblin.com/BCTB301.pdf
>
> BTW, O3 (Ozone) has a specific gravity of 1.66. How come there is an
> ozone layer if it is "heavier than air"?
>
> I wish I had a nickel for every time I've heard a technician, too lazy
> to think for himself, whine the tired old litany "But the manual says....."
>
> --
> jeff

Well, no **** Sherlock! EXCEPT the conversation was about CFCs which are
MOLECULES! Come on Google boy, what is the atomic weight of Freon-12,
and what is it's element number?

--
what a maroon.
jeff




L.W.(ßill) Hughes III wrote:
> Atomic Table, you know that chart with every element known to man:
> http://web.mit.edu/3.091/www/pt/
> God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
> http://www.billhughes.com/
>
> jeff wrote:
>
>>Atomic weights? Do you mean the specific gravity of molecular compounds?
>>Here's a list if you are really interested, but it does not really
>>address the issue of atmospheric mixing and the process of diffusion.
>>http://www.burtoncorblin.com/BCTB301.pdf
>>
>>BTW, O3 (Ozone) has a specific gravity of 1.66. How come there is an
>>ozone layer if it is "heavier than air"?
>>
>>I wish I had a nickel for every time I've heard a technician, too lazy
>>to think for himself, whine the tired old litany "But the manual says....."
>>
>>--
>>jeff

http://physics.nist.gov/cgi-bin/Star...s.pl?matno=161
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
http://www.billhughes.com/

jeff wrote:
>
> Well, no **** Sherlock! EXCEPT the conversation was about CFCs which are
> MOLECULES! Come on Google boy, what is the atomic weight of Freon-12,
> and what is it's element number?
>
> --
> what a maroon.
> jeff

Composition of FREON-12:
Density (g/cm3) = 1.12000E+00
Mean Excitation Energy (eV) = 143.000000

COMPOSITION:

Atomic number Fraction by weight
6 0.099335
9 0.314247
17 0.586418

Refrigerant R12 (Freon-12-CCl2F2)

R-12 is a very popular refrigerant. It is a colorless, almost odorless
liquid with a boiling

point of -29°C at atmospheric pressure. It is nontoxic, noncorrosive,
nonirritating and

nonflammable. R-12 has a relatively low latent heat value. In the smaller
refrigerating machines, this is an

advantage. The large amount of refrigerant circulated will permit this use
of less sensitive and

more positive operating and regulating mechanisms. It is used in
reciprocating, rotary and large

centrifugal compressors. It operates at a low but positive head and back
pressure and with a

good volumetric efficiency. R-12 ha a pressure 183 kPa at -15°C and a
pressure of 745 kPa at 30°C. The latent heat of R-12

at -15°C is 159 J gG 1 (Althouse et al., 1992).

J. Biol. Sci., 3 (12): 1114-1125, 2003

The composition of Freon R-12 is Carbon, Chlorine, and Fluorine



"jeff" > wrote in message
news:Qygwe.1746$Ku6.1305@trnddc04...
> Well, no **** Sherlock! EXCEPT the conversation was about CFCs which are
> MOLECULES! Come on Google boy, what is the atomic weight of Freon-12, and
> what is it's element number?
>
> --
> what a maroon.
> jeff
>
>
>
>
> L.W.(ßill) Hughes III wrote:
>> Atomic Table, you know that chart with every element known to man:
>> http://web.mit.edu/3.091/www/pt/ God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
>> http://www.billhughes.com/
>>
>> jeff wrote:
>>
>>>Atomic weights? Do you mean the specific gravity of molecular compounds?
>>>Here's a list if you are really interested, but it does not really
>>>address the issue of atmospheric mixing and the process of diffusion.
>>>http://www.burtoncorblin.com/BCTB301.pdf
>>>
>>>BTW, O3 (Ozone) has a specific gravity of 1.66. How come there is an
>>>ozone layer if it is "heavier than air"?
>>>
>>>I wish I had a nickel for every time I've heard a technician, too lazy
>>>to think for himself, whine the tired old litany "But the manual
>>>says....."
>>>
>>>--
>>>jeff

Freon is a *compound*. Bill's pointing out the periodic chart of
*elements* only exposes his ignorance on the subject. Freon is not an
"element" and you cannot talk about it's atomic weight because it is not
an atom, it is a molecule. You can talk about it's molecular weight, or
the atomic weight of it's constituent atoms, and their fraction by
weight, which is what you have provided.

F
|
Cl--C--F
|
Cl


--
jeff



Billy Ray wrote:
> Composition of FREON-12:
> Density (g/cm3) = 1.12000E+00
> Mean Excitation Energy (eV) = 143.000000
>
> COMPOSITION:
>
> Atomic number Fraction by weight
> 6 0.099335
> 9 0.314247
> 17 0.586418
>
> Refrigerant R12 (Freon-12-CCl2F2)
>
> R-12 is a very popular refrigerant. It is a colorless, almost odorless
> liquid with a boiling
> The composition of Freon R-12 is Carbon, Chlorine, and Fluorine
>

And I gave you the compound Atomic weights they are 6, 9, & 17 Or
Carbon, Fluorine, and Chlorine, if you couldn't figure it out.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
http://www.billhughes.com/

jeff wrote:
>
> Freon is a *compound*. Bill's pointing out the periodic chart of
> *elements* only exposes his ignorance on the subject. Freon is not an
> "element" and you cannot talk about it's atomic weight because it is not
> an atom, it is a molecule. You can talk about it's molecular weight, or
> the atomic weight of it's constituent atoms, and their fraction by
> weight, which is what you have provided.
>
> F
> |
> Cl--C--F
> |
> Cl
>
> --
> jeff

So, Rich, it has been some 23 days and several hundred posts. Have you
learned where you can find more R134a? With the information here, you should
be able to make some on your kitchen stove ...






"Rich Hampel" > wrote in message
...
> OK, perhaps the eco-nazis have done us in again.
> In the NE yesterday I tried to get some R134a ..... and NO ONE in
> western NJ, Eastern Penna. or Delaware has any ...... ???????
> I can get it online from Florida .... at about 400% above the 'normal'
> price.
> I know the manufacturer, duPont, has had problems in production and
> legal - as they are appraently having GREAT legal problems with all
> their Fluorine based products. The production problems started last
> year but duPont advised that all would be 'remedied' by December 2004.
>
> Any suggestions; or, should I just bite the bullet and find some
> bootleg R12 and switch back?

I knew what Bill meant as did everyone else with one exception.


"jeff" > wrote in message
news:r2jwe.6303$gm6.2995@trnddc05...
> Freon is a *compound*. Bill's pointing out the periodic chart of
> *elements* only exposes his ignorance on the subject. Freon is not an
> "element" and you cannot talk about it's atomic weight because it is not
> an atom, it is a molecule. You can talk about it's molecular weight, or
> the atomic weight of it's constituent atoms, and their fraction by weight,
> which is what you have provided.
>
> F
> |
> Cl--C--F
> |
> Cl
>
>
> --
> jeff
>
>
>
> Billy Ray wrote:
>> Composition of FREON-12:
>> Density (g/cm3) = 1.12000E+00
>> Mean Excitation Energy (eV) = 143.000000
>>
>> COMPOSITION:
>>
>> Atomic number Fraction by weight
>> 6 0.099335
>> 9 0.314247
>> 17 0.586418
>>
>> Refrigerant R12 (Freon-12-CCl2F2)
>>
>> R-12 is a very popular refrigerant. It is a colorless, almost odorless
>> liquid with a boiling
>> The composition of Freon R-12 is Carbon, Chlorine, and Fluorine
>>