1992 Camry Timing Belt

Recently had to go to PepBoys (dont hang me for this as I already feel
as I have made a mistake) to get an emergency replacement of the water
pump on a 92 Camry 4 cylinder. Car had approximately 108K miles on it
so asked for timing belt replacement.

I am not a mechanic by any means.

Got car back and it seemed to be OK but sluggish (i.e. pick up in
acceleration was not what it was before). Brought it back and the
mechanic showed me a couple of things 1)said slack in transmission
cable was cause and 2) cracked air flow hose. Also he said he made some
sort of adjustment to the timing. Showed me timing light and something
about it being stable proving proper instatllation.

I notice the car is noiser than usual though it is more peppy. He did
make some sort of adjustment to the ignition timing. I am not a
mechanic but could he have altered the timing to compensate for
improper installation of the belt? Can someone explain ignition timing
versus valve timing to me? What damage might this cause, if any? Did I
get a bad water pump? Getting noiser by the day seem like and this is
about 200 miles after installation.

How can I check that installation was proper? Should I take it to
another mechanic to get it double checked and what do I ask for?

On 3 Mar 2005 19:18:20 -0800, wrote:

>Recently had to go to PepBoys (dont hang me for this as I already feel
>as I have made a mistake) to get an emergency replacement of the water
>pump on a 92 Camry 4 cylinder. Car had approximately 108K miles on it
>so asked for timing belt replacement.
>
>I am not a mechanic by any means.
>
>Got car back and it seemed to be OK but sluggish

Here you say the car is sluggish


> (i.e. pick up in
>acceleration was not what it was before). Brought it back and the
>mechanic showed me a couple of things 1)said slack in transmission
>cable was cause and 2) cracked air flow hose. Also he said he made some
>sort of adjustment to the timing. Showed me timing light and something
>about it being stable proving proper instatllation.
>
>I notice the car is noiser than usual though it is more peppy

Here you say it isn't

>. He did
>make some sort of adjustment to the ignition timing. I am not a
>mechanic but could he have altered the timing to compensate for
>improper installation of the belt? Can someone explain ignition timing
>versus valve timing to me? What damage might this cause, if any? Did I
>get a bad water pump? Getting noiser by the day seem like and this is
>about 200 miles after installation.
>
>How can I check that installation was proper? Should I take it to
>another mechanic to get it double checked and what do I ask for?

Which is it

wrote:
> Recently had to go to PepBoys (dont hang me for this as I already
feel
> as I have made a mistake) to get an emergency replacement of the
water
> pump on a 92 Camry 4 cylinder. Car had approximately 108K miles on it
> so asked for timing belt replacement.
>
> I am not a mechanic by any means.
>
> Got car back and it seemed to be OK but sluggish (i.e. pick up in
> acceleration was not what it was before). Brought it back and the
> mechanic showed me a couple of things 1)said slack in transmission
> cable was cause and 2) cracked air flow hose. Also he said he made
some
> sort of adjustment to the timing. Showed me timing light and
something
> about it being stable proving proper instatllation.
>
> I notice the car is noiser than usual though it is more peppy. He did
> make some sort of adjustment to the ignition timing. I am not a
> mechanic but could he have altered the timing to compensate for
> improper installation of the belt? Can someone explain ignition
timing
> versus valve timing to me? What damage might this cause, if any? Did
I
> get a bad water pump? Getting noiser by the day seem like and this is
> about 200 miles after installation.
>
> How can I check that installation was proper? Should I take it to
> another mechanic to get it double checked and what do I ask for?


Hello,
This is what happened to your Camry. First, you went to Pep Boys and
had an incompetent employee of said establishment do a T-belt /
waterpump job. Then employee installed your T-belt very loose and BTW
used a junk aftermarket part (universal belt number 138) that will most
likely stretch and/or disintegrate in the next few years. The belt
gears may or may not have been timed properly on installation.
Regardless, now your cam is a tooth off in the retarded direction,
causing idle difficulties and lower power. The spark timing has also
changed; its now retarded about 10 - 15 degrees since the distributor
runs off the cam.

What it *seems* like your "mechanic" did upon your return, judging from
you description, was to advance the spark timing at the distributor to
WRONGLY compensate for the cam timing being off a tooth.

The noise you are hearing is the timing belt looseness is so out of
control that it is slapping against the forwardmost inside surface of
the upper timing belt cover. They can make a God awful racket when
really loose. They sound quite alot like a bad waterpump bearing
noise, conveniently enough....

Here's two more lies you were fed:
1) Your transaxle cable "tells" the tranny how much you are pushing on
the throttle. Simply put, what this does inside the transaxle is to
increase operating pressure on your holding devices so they don't slip
under heavier loads. It does NOT control shift timing. Old
hydraulically (non-electronic) transmissions had a cable for that
purpose. Perhaps your "mechanic" was thinking of the last vehicle's
transmission that he could comprehend; maybe a 1971 Nova that he took
apart and almost got back together once in his parent's garage.
2)You have a "speed density" EFI system, i.e. a MAP sensor equipped
computer controlled fuel injected engine. The intake hose could be
missing and it wouldn't make the car run one bit worse. Have your
"mechanic" look into this technology. It's only been around for a few
decades.

It sounds like you have been boned by Manny, Moe and Jack. I would
suggest getting some friends' opinions on good shops in your area,
either independent or Toyota dealer. Make a wise choice in shops,
forget about Pep Boys, and spend a little labor on having a real
mechanic un-screw-up whatever your butcher has touched. For all you
know, your waterpump is not installed properly (that's a harder job in
terms of skill than the T-belt!). I wouldn't waste my time going back
there anymore to try and get an incompetent fool to fix it. He'll
probably just intimidate you with his "knowledge" and blow you off
again. Give a good shop a try.

Good luck,
Toyota MDT in MO

Excellent reply, MDT - and thank you - I learned a lot from that reply.

The OP did seem to know that going to Pep Boys wasn't the wisest move,
but hey, bleep happens.

With today's cars you just can't guess - you have to KNOW and even when
you know you have to do it RIGHT....

wrote:
> Excellent reply, MDT - and thank you - I learned a lot from that
reply.
>
> The OP did seem to know that going to Pep Boys wasn't the wisest
move,
> but hey, bleep happens.
>
> With today's cars you just can't guess - you have to KNOW and even
when
> you know you have to do it RIGHT....


I was feeling a little bitchy when I wrote that. I have no specific
problem with Pep Fools over any other low quality, low price chain
repair store. They all suck a higher percentage of the time than any
average shop. What does make me sick is when butchers or thieves go
into the auto repair industry. There's alot of misinformation out
there and its hard for a layman to decipher the truth regarding
"necessary repairs".

Word of mouth from friends and family is a really good way to find a
shop. And when you go with a shop, have them do some simple
maintenance for you the first couple of times to see how you are
treated before throwing down hundreds or thousands of dollars for major
work. I.E. find a good shop now before you have a major breakdown and
NEED one. With a really good mechanic, you might be told about warning
signs of impending failure before it happens and actually save money
via preventive repair(s).

Toyota MDT in MO