Oil change 2004 Vue

Oil change light will come on after about six months and normal driving.If
its not on yet,don't worry it will light up around 6k
"John Sloan" > wrote in message
m...
> I have 5K on my vue now and still no change oil light. I'm on the verge
of
> taking it to the Saturn store just to find out if the light is working.
> Whats the normal milage for changing oil?
> John
>
>

In article >,
says...
>
>
> Blah Blah wrote:
>
> > The problem with that light is it doesnt take into account a new engine
> > needs "break in" time nor does it know if you are using synthetic or
> > conventional or 5w20 or 10w40 nor does it know if your filter is being
> > bypassed. It also doesnt take into account that the longer you run your
> > oil the more your oil bakes onto and varnishes your engine. If I pull a
> > dipstick or oil cap on a engine with 6k mile oil change intervals, I'll
> > know. The longer you run without changing the oil the greater the chance
> > of a problem not being caught in time as well. Lord knows people dont
> > know howto pop their hoods these days and look things over.
>
> The "light" assumes 5W30 oil that meets the requirments set
> forth in the owner's guide. GM has no special break-in
> requirements listed in the manual.

No manufacturer to my knowledge has ever give any break in
"requirements". However do you think its wise to rev that engine upto
7000 rpm every chance you get the first 500 miles? No? Engines do have a
break in time but no manufacturer is going to tell you that. Major proof
that you need to give your engine time to break in would be with
Cadillacs northstar engines. They have interference fit valves and if
you were to check the compression readings on a fresh motor to one with
1000 miles you would see a huge difference.

> I have no idea how you
> would know if the filter is being bypassed.

Lets see. New filter tech, tighter screen mesh, metal shavings and chips
from a brand new engine. Yeah I say its getting pretty restrictive.

> I changed the
> oil in my Vue at around 1k miles (old habits die hard), but
> have not changed it since at less than 6k intrvals (and I
> still have not tiggered the light - I did reset it after
> each change per the instructions). I do check the oil
> regularrly. I have seen no evidence of scum or varnish or
> any other oil related problems. In fact, the oil in my Vue
> looks bettter after 6000 miles, than the oil in my old
> Toyota looked after 100 miles. 3000 mile oil changes belong
> to the past when cars and oils weren't as good. American are
> literally wasting millions of dollars on unecessary oil
> changes becasue of old guy thinking. I know it is hard to
> break the 3000 mile oil change addiciton, but try hard. My
> Sister has a Honda. It also has an oil change indicator -
> but it is merely odometer driven with no compensation for
> cold or hot running or the number of starts. She never
> changes the oil before the indicator turns red (7500 miles).
> The car now has over 100k miles and is almost 8 years old.
> The paint is falling off the bumpers, the interior looks
> like crap, but the engine runs like a clock, uses no oil,
> and pull like new. Exacly how much better off would she be
> if she had spent an extra $400 or so on oil changes?
>
> Ed

Everyone drives differently and in different climates. Some people are
harder on their engines than you and your sister and some people dont
buy quality oils. Making a broad statement like that and expecting
everyone to have the same variables is a long shot. 4000 miles is the
limit I give any filter and 500 miles on a "fresh" engine is the limit
that should be given for both oil and filter. Besides that 100k miles on
that engine aint nothing. Thats a fraction of what a motor should be
able to reach if cared for. Sounds like the rest of it isnt keeping up
though so it wouldnt mater in that cars case.

Blah Blah wrote:
>
> In article >,
> says...
> >
> >
> > Blah Blah wrote:
> >
> > > The problem with that light is it doesnt take into account a new engine
> > > needs "break in" time nor does it know if you are using synthetic or
> > > conventional or 5w20 or 10w40 nor does it know if your filter is being
> > > bypassed. It also doesnt take into account that the longer you run your
> > > oil the more your oil bakes onto and varnishes your engine. If I pull a
> > > dipstick or oil cap on a engine with 6k mile oil change intervals, I'll
> > > know. The longer you run without changing the oil the greater the chance
> > > of a problem not being caught in time as well. Lord knows people dont
> > > know howto pop their hoods these days and look things over.
> >
> > The "light" assumes 5W30 oil that meets the requirments set
> > forth in the owner's guide. GM has no special break-in
> > requirements listed in the manual.
>
> No manufacturer to my knowledge has ever give any break in
> "requirements". However do you think its wise to rev that engine upto
> 7000 rpm every chance you get the first 500 miles? No? Engines do have a
> break in time but no manufacturer is going to tell you that. Major proof
> that you need to give your engine time to break in would be with
> Cadillacs northstar engines. They have interference fit valves and if
> you were to check the compression readings on a fresh motor to one with
> 1000 miles you would see a huge difference.
>
> > I have no idea how you
> > would know if the filter is being bypassed.
>
> Lets see. New filter tech, tighter screen mesh, metal shavings and chips
> from a brand new engine. Yeah I say its getting pretty restrictive.

Is this just idle speculation? Why wouldn't GM require an
early oil change if this was the case? I have cut a few
filters open and rarely see anything significant. It is easy
to examine the outside of the Vue's filter, and I haven't
seen anything of interest so far. There was nothing at all
left in the cartridge holder.

> > I changed the
> > oil in my Vue at around 1k miles (old habits die hard), but
> > have not changed it since at less than 6k intrvals (and I
> > still have not tiggered the light - I did reset it after
> > each change per the instructions). I do check the oil
> > regularrly. I have seen no evidence of scum or varnish or
> > any other oil related problems. In fact, the oil in my Vue
> > looks bettter after 6000 miles, than the oil in my old
> > Toyota looked after 100 miles. 3000 mile oil changes belong
> > to the past when cars and oils weren't as good. American are
> > literally wasting millions of dollars on unecessary oil
> > changes becasue of old guy thinking. I know it is hard to
> > break the 3000 mile oil change addiciton, but try hard. My
> > Sister has a Honda. It also has an oil change indicator -
> > but it is merely odometer driven with no compensation for
> > cold or hot running or the number of starts. She never
> > changes the oil before the indicator turns red (7500 miles).
> > The car now has over 100k miles and is almost 8 years old.
> > The paint is falling off the bumpers, the interior looks
> > like crap, but the engine runs like a clock, uses no oil,
> > and pull like new. Exacly how much better off would she be
> > if she had spent an extra $400 or so on oil changes?
> >
> > Ed
>
> Everyone drives differently and in different climates. Some people are
> harder on their engines than you and your sister....

Until this year my Sister's normal commute was 2 miles one
way. She essentially drove the car in 2 mile segments
separated by long periods of time parked. This is pretty
hard on an engine. I am easier on an engine than she by a
long shot.

> and some people dont buy quality oils.

You need to define quality oil. If it meets the
specifications set forth in your owner's guide, then it
should be "quality oil." If it doesn't, then all bets are
off and you certainly shouldn't count on the oil change
indicatior.

> Making a broad statement like that and expecting
> everyone to have the same variables is a long shot. 4000 miles is the
> limit I give any filter and 500 miles on a "fresh" engine is the limit
> that should be given for both oil and filter.

And you are basing this limit on your Grandfather's wisdom?
You don't think the engineers at GM can size a filter to
last 75000 miles? How about European cars that use the same
size filter, but specify even longer oil change intervals
(10k or more miles)? Engines are better today, oil is better
today, filters are better today, fuel injection systems
don't dilute the oil with excess fuel, the oil isn't
contaminated with TEL, etc., etc., etc. - why do you think
you need to stick to the same oil change recommendations
that were in place in 1957? If anything, the oil change
intervals indicated by the oil change light are probably
conservative.

> Besides that 100k miles on
> that engine aint nothing. Thats a fraction of what a motor should be
> able to reach if cared for. Sounds like the rest of it isnt keeping up
> though so it wouldnt mater in that cars case.

You are now making my point. I have never gotten rid of a
vechile becasue of a bad engine. In the end, I dump them
becasue they are falling apart around a perfectly good
engine or becasue I am just tired of them. Why spend
hundreds extra making unecessary oil changes? Who are you
helping - the junk yard operator? I've have a 25 year old
farm tractor with 6000 hours (roughtly equivalent to 200,000
miles)that has a good engine and I have never changed the
oil more often than every 150 hours (roughly equivalent to
5,000 miles). This engines has been worked far harder, under
far more severe conditions than 95% of all car engines.

We all have to make our own decision on what is best.
However, I think we are being brain washed by places like
Jiffy Lube into believeing that we need to change our oil
every 3000 miles (or sooner). I believe that 5,000 mile oil
changes are mor ethan sufficient for 95% of all drivers. I
also applaud GM for including an oil change indicator that
is based on more than just miles in their newer vechiles. I
believe if owners would use this system, they can save
themselves time and money, while not reducing the useful
life of thier vehicles.

Regards,

Ed White

The reason I don't trust the light is it will go up to 7,000 miles
before it goes on (i've had it not reset when I've gotten oil changed)..
in my book 7,000 miles is just way too long to go between oil changes.

Mine has gone all the way to 7,000 or 8,000 YIKES! That's a bit long.

Matt wrote:
>
> The reason I don't trust the light is it will go up to 7,000 miles
> before it goes on (i've had it not reset when I've gotten oil changed)..
> in my book 7,000 miles is just way too long to go between oil changes.

But why do you think 7000 miles is too long? Did you have
the oil analysed after 7000 miles?

I haven't actaully let mine go that far yet, but it is not
becasue I don't trust the light. It is that the three times
I have changed oil, I did so for convenience reasons (more
than 6000 miles on the oil and it was a slow weekend, or I
was getting ready for a long trip, etc.).

I don't understand the reluctance to trust the oil change
indicator light, or the belief that modern oil in a modern
engines can't last longer than non-detergent 30W oil did in
a 57 Studebaker. 3000 mile oil changes seems to be a
uniquely North American habit. Ford and GM sell the same
engines is different markets and specify far longer oil
change intervals in Europe than in the US. For instance, in
Europe the Ecotech engines have 20,000 mile maximum service
interval instead of the 7500 maximum for the US. I believe
they do use 5W30 synthetic oil instead of 5W30 conventional,
but then they also offer more highly stressed turbo models.
See http://www.migweb.co.uk/forums/archi...ex.php/t-17134
:

"New Vectra features a flexible service indicator, which
provides information on when servicing is required depending
on how the car is used. Petrol engines require an oil change
at 20,000 miles (or up to two years) while the diesels are
up to 30,000 miles (or two years)."

And we are worried about 3,000 vs 7,000 mile oil
changes....geez. In Europe they argue whether 10,000 mile,
20,000 mile or 30,000 mile oil changes are needed.

Regards,

Ed White

I agree with you about oil change interval (even though I use 3k
interval myself - brainwashing...), but not about break-in period.
Advance of contemporary technology doesn't change the laws of physics.
Being a mechanical engineer by education, I remember a college course
about machine-cutting equipment and how to correctly break-in that
machinery. Engines with their high dynamics and temperatures are even
more sensitive to correct procedure of a breaking-in. You need a good
magnification to be able to see in the oil particles, which are a
product of accelerated wear during break-in. A properly conducted
breaking-in and a proper maintenance could provide a
quality-manufactured engine a life span of 1,000,000 miles. Removing
break-in procedure greatly reduces a life span of an engine but still
it could be well above 100k miles. I don't think GM wants an engine
last 1,000,000 miles, and most people won't complain if it lasts about
200k miles. Also, GM doesn't require early oil change, which is a part
of break-in procedure, because we live in the society where even
slightest inconvenience is very undesirable and could steer a
potential customer to a competitor.

"C. E. White" > wrote in message >...
> Is this just idle speculation? Why wouldn't GM require an
> early oil change if this was the case? I have cut a few
> filters open and rarely see anything significant. It is easy
> to examine the outside of the Vue's filter, and I haven't
> seen anything of interest so far. There was nothing at all
> left in the cartridge holder.

In article >,
says...
>
>
> Matt wrote:
> >
> > The reason I don't trust the light is it will go up to 7,000 miles
> > before it goes on (i've had it not reset when I've gotten oil changed)..
> > in my book 7,000 miles is just way too long to go between oil changes.
>
> But why do you think 7000 miles is too long? Did you have
> the oil analysed after 7000 miles?
>
> I haven't actaully let mine go that far yet, but it is not
> becasue I don't trust the light. It is that the three times
> I have changed oil, I did so for convenience reasons (more
> than 6000 miles on the oil and it was a slow weekend, or I
> was getting ready for a long trip, etc.).
>
> I don't understand the reluctance to trust the oil change
> indicator light, or the belief that modern oil in a modern
> engines can't last longer than non-detergent 30W oil did in
> a 57 Studebaker. 3000 mile oil changes seems to be a
> uniquely North American habit. Ford and GM sell the same
> engines is different markets and specify far longer oil
> change intervals in Europe than in the US. For instance, in
> Europe the Ecotech engines have 20,000 mile maximum service
> interval instead of the 7500 maximum for the US. I believe
> they do use 5W30 synthetic oil instead of 5W30 conventional,
> but then they also offer more highly stressed turbo models.
> See http://www.migweb.co.uk/forums/archi...ex.php/t-17134
> :
>
> "New Vectra features a flexible service indicator, which
> provides information on when servicing is required depending
> on how the car is used. Petrol engines require an oil change
> at 20,000 miles (or up to two years) while the diesels are
> up to 30,000 miles (or two years)."
>
> And we are worried about 3,000 vs 7,000 mile oil
> changes....geez. In Europe they argue whether 10,000 mile,
> 20,000 mile or 30,000 mile oil changes are needed.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ed White

From what little I read of your post, do to lack of interest and my
personal experience dealing with poorly maintained engines, it looks as
though you haven't rebuilt or pulled many 7-10k oil change engines. Nor
have you had experience dealing with the oiling for the timing chain on
a 1.9L. And your argument about "oil being wasted", yeah if you
illegally dump it on the ground its wasted. The rest of us however take
our oil to a recycling center. If you never seen a modern engine with
rocker arms cutting groves in oil gunk then dont argue with me about the
need for 3-4k mile oil & filter changes. People still think Castrol is a
quality oil and like hell if I would have that in my engine for 7k miles
yet alone 1k.

In article >, elkon123
@fastmail.fm says...
> I agree with you about oil change interval (even though I use 3k
> interval myself - brainwashing...), but not about break-in period.
> Advance of contemporary technology doesn't change the laws of physics.
> Being a mechanical engineer by education, I remember a college course
> about machine-cutting equipment and how to correctly break-in that
> machinery. Engines with their high dynamics and temperatures are even
> more sensitive to correct procedure of a breaking-in. You need a good
> magnification to be able to see in the oil particles, which are a
> product of accelerated wear during break-in. A properly conducted
> breaking-in and a proper maintenance could provide a
> quality-manufactured engine a life span of 1,000,000 miles. Removing
> break-in procedure greatly reduces a life span of an engine but still
> it could be well above 100k miles. I don't think GM wants an engine
> last 1,000,000 miles, and most people won't complain if it lasts about
> 200k miles. Also, GM doesn't require early oil change, which is a part
> of break-in procedure, because we live in the society where even
> slightest inconvenience is very undesirable and could steer a
> potential customer to a competitor.
>

Exactly. Well put Jerry. Thats the reason why I dont recommend synthetic
oil for the first 6000 miles. It never breaks in right.

I agree with this approach. I think 3000 mile oil changes are a thing of
the past. I don't think GM would recommend something that would harm the
engine with the competitive auto market today. Doubt if I'll go till the
light comes on but 5K sounds good to me.
John

"C. E. White" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Blah Blah wrote:
>
> > The problem with that light is it doesnt take into account a new engine
> > needs "break in" time nor does it know if you are using synthetic or
> > conventional or 5w20 or 10w40 nor does it know if your filter is being
> > bypassed. It also doesnt take into account that the longer you run your
> > oil the more your oil bakes onto and varnishes your engine. If I pull a
> > dipstick or oil cap on a engine with 6k mile oil change intervals, I'll
> > know. The longer you run without changing the oil the greater the chance
> > of a problem not being caught in time as well. Lord knows people dont
> > know howto pop their hoods these days and look things over.
>
> The "light" assumes 5W30 oil that meets the requirments set
> forth in the owner's guide. GM has no special break-in
> requirements listed in the manual. I have no idea how you
> would know if the filter is being bypassed. I changed the
> oil in my Vue at around 1k miles (old habits die hard), but
> have not changed it since at less than 6k intrvals (and I
> still have not tiggered the light - I did reset it after
> each change per the instructions). I do check the oil
> regularrly. I have seen no evidence of scum or varnish or
> any other oil related problems. In fact, the oil in my Vue
> looks bettter after 6000 miles, than the oil in my old
> Toyota looked after 100 miles. 3000 mile oil changes belong
> to the past when cars and oils weren't as good. American are
> literally wasting millions of dollars on unecessary oil
> changes becasue of old guy thinking. I know it is hard to
> break the 3000 mile oil change addiciton, but try hard. My
> Sister has a Honda. It also has an oil change indicator -
> but it is merely odometer driven with no compensation for
> cold or hot running or the number of starts. She never
> changes the oil before the indicator turns red (7500 miles).
> The car now has over 100k miles and is almost 8 years old.
> The paint is falling off the bumpers, the interior looks
> like crap, but the engine runs like a clock, uses no oil,
> and pull like new. Exacly how much better off would she be
> if she had spent an extra $400 or so on oil changes?
>
> Ed