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99 Sunfire lights problem



 
 
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  #11  
Old March 11th 05, 01:18 AM
Steve
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HLS wrote:
> "Daniel J. Stern" > wrote in message
> .umich.edu...
>
>>On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Backbone wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>A couple of weeks ago my low beams would not work. The DRL and high
>>>
>>>Question. what is a DRL?

>>
>>Daytime Running Lights.

>
>
> You and I ran afoul of each other on a previous post regarding DRL's, and I
> suspect that the semantics may have been part of the issue.
>
> The automatic lighting systems I am used to activate low beam headlights,
> sidelights, and tail lights, day or night. I refer to these as DRL's.
>
> Does DRL mean something different to you, Daniel?


DRL has a completely different and standardized definition. It refers to
white lights, mounted on the front of the car, that operate whenever the
headlights and other lights are OFF. When the headlights and marker
lights come on, the DRLs go OFF.
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  #12  
Old March 11th 05, 03:11 AM
Daniel J. Stern
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On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Steve wrote:

> > The automatic lighting systems I am used to activate low beam
> > headlights, sidelights, and tail lights, day or night. I refer to
> > these as DRL's. Does DRL mean something different to you, Daniel?


> DRL has a completely different and standardized definition. It refers to
> white lights, mounted on the front of the car, that operate whenever the
> headlights and other lights are OFF. When the headlights and marker
> lights come on, the DRLs go OFF.


Your definition is accurate outside North America, but not within North
America. In North America, DRLs are allowed to be white, selective yellow,
amber or any color in between. They're required to stay on with the
parker/marking lights by Canadian law. They're required to turn off with
the parker/marking lights by US law, but this provision is not enforced.


  #13  
Old March 11th 05, 04:43 AM
Comboverfish
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Daniel J Stern wrote:
>*Full-time steady burning of the front turn signals alone


I'm sure you are correct, but my first thought was "you're kidding!"

Is there an example of a car in production that does this? One amp
non-focused yellow lights in bright sunlight seems useless to me.
Please tell me what I'm missing!

Toyota MDT in MO

  #14  
Old March 11th 05, 05:18 AM
Bob M.
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"Comboverfish" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Daniel J Stern wrote:
>>*Full-time steady burning of the front turn signals alone

>
> I'm sure you are correct, but my first thought was "you're kidding!"
>
> Is there an example of a car in production that does this? One amp
> non-focused yellow lights in bright sunlight seems useless to me.
> Please tell me what I'm missing!
>


Check out any Chevy/GMC full-size cargo van, they're afflicted with the
"damn running lights" like that.


  #15  
Old March 11th 05, 05:52 AM
Comboverfish
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Bob M. wrote:
> "Comboverfish" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> > Daniel J Stern wrote:
> >>*Full-time steady burning of the front turn signals alone

> >
> > I'm sure you are correct, but my first thought was "you're

kidding!"
> >
> > Is there an example of a car in production that does this? One amp
> > non-focused yellow lights in bright sunlight seems useless to me.
> > Please tell me what I'm missing!
> >

>
> Check out any Chevy/GMC full-size cargo van, they're afflicted with

the
> "damn running lights" like that.


Unless the van is different than the trucks, I'm familiar with the 1999
and up independent Chevy DRL beams. I think those are satisfactory.
Plus, they're white, not yellow. Most turn signal housings are yellow,
so my ASSumption here regarding D.S. statement is that it would most
likely involve a yellow lens, and if not, atleast a yellow bulb.

Toyota MDT in MO

  #16  
Old March 11th 05, 02:25 PM
HLS
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"Daniel J. Stern" > wrote in message
.umich.edu...

>
> Note that in Canada, DRLs are required to burn until the *headlamps* are
> turned on, so DRLs continue to operate when the parking lamps (only) are
> switched on. In the US, on the other hand, DRLs are required to extinguish
> when the parking lamps are turned on. However, this provision of the law
> has not been enforced and so there are millions of noncompliant vehicles
> on US roads (they comply with the Canadian "DRLs must stay on with parking
> lamps" law).


This answers a lot. Typical of the USA to have a number of competing
systems
and not enforce much of anything.

I am a firm believer that proper lighting prevents accidents. Many
Americans
don't light properly, drive far too fast in bad conditions, and believe that
any law which is not enforced (and many that ARE) do not apply to them.


  #17  
Old March 11th 05, 06:04 PM
Daniel J. Stern
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On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Comboverfish wrote:

> >*Full-time steady burning of the front turn signals alone


> I'm sure you are correct, but my first thought was "you're kidding!" Is
> there an example of a car in production that does this?


Su

Several Saturns including the Ion
Most current-production Cadillacs
The last Buick Century
The last Olds Intrigue
The current Chev/GMC full-size vans
'96-'00 Chrysler minivans (in Canada)
The '97-up GM minivans (Chev Venture, Pontiac Montana, Olds Silhouette,
Saturn Relay, Buick Terrazza)
The current Chevrolet Malibu
Several current Toyotas (at least in Canada).

> One amp non-focused yellow lights in bright sunlight seems useless to
> me. Please tell me what I'm missing!


Well, you're missing a few things, most notably that light is not measured
in amps. it's measured in candela, candlepower, lux or lumens. There is no
such thing as "an amp of light". That's because different ways of making
light have different levels of efficiency. Except for the fact that
they're amber and therefore introduce ambiguity into the front signal
system, turn signal DRLs are dandy. They produce just about the perfect
amount of light, distributed through just about perfect horizontal and
vertical angles, for an effective daytime running light without glare.

Now if only they were white (or some color other than amber), they *would*
be just about perfect.

DS
  #18  
Old March 11th 05, 06:06 PM
Daniel J. Stern
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On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Comboverfish wrote:

> > Check out any Chevy/GMC full-size cargo van, they're afflicted with
> > the "damn running lights" like that.


> Unless the van is different than the trucks


The van is different than the trucks.

> I'm familiar with the 1999 and up independent Chevy DRL beams. I think
> those are satisfactory. Plus, they're white, not yellow.


White on the trucks, amber on the vans. And they're mostly satisfactory
from a performance standpoint, but UNsatisfactory from a bulb-life
standpoint. GM made a stupid choice of bulb type.

> Most turn signal housings are yellow


??? Nowtimes most turn signal "housings" (=lenses) are clear with an amber
bulb.

  #19  
Old March 11th 05, 07:49 PM
ray
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Daniel J. Stern wrote:

> Su
>
> Several Saturns including the Ion
> Most current-production Cadillacs
> The last Buick Century
> The last Olds Intrigue
> The current Chev/GMC full-size vans
> '96-'00 Chrysler minivans (in Canada)
> The '97-up GM minivans (Chev Venture, Pontiac Montana, Olds Silhouette,
> Saturn Relay, Buick Terrazza)
> The current Chevrolet Malibu
> Several current Toyotas (at least in Canada).
>
>
>>One amp non-focused yellow lights in bright sunlight seems useless to
>>me. Please tell me what I'm missing!

>


93-2002 Firebirds use turn signal DRLs.
  #20  
Old March 12th 05, 02:28 AM
Comboverfish
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Daniel J. Stern wrote:
> Well, you're missing a few things, most notably that light is not

measured
> in amps. it's measured in candela, candlepower, lux or lumens. There

is no
> such thing as "an amp of light". That's because different ways of

making
> light have different levels of efficiency. Except for the fact that
> they're amber and therefore introduce ambiguity into the front signal
> system, turn signal DRLs are dandy. They produce just about the

perfect
> amount of light, distributed through just about perfect horizontal

and
> vertical angles, for an effective daytime running light without

glare.


I understand the concept of amperage, light power, and efficiency. I
was just making a flip comment on the fact that manufacturers were
using what roughly amounts to an 1157 for DRL purposes. I would much
prefer series-ed high beams for the extra cost of the relays or module.
I'm not a safety nazi but I strongly feel that low output amber light
is significantly less noticeable in daylight than headlight style DRL
beams.


> Now if only they were white (or some color other than amber),
>they *would* be just about perfect.


Word. Thanks for the info. Especially the list of GMs, er, I mean
manufacturers that use turn signal DRLs.

Toyota MDT in MO

 




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