Buying a new car

The first time I bought a car I ordered it with the options I wanted.
We agreed on the price and when the car arrived at the dealership I had
a cashiers check for the car.

The dealer had a rebate check that was issued from Ford with my name on
it. He asked me to sign the check and took put it in the cash drawer.

Nothing was ever mentioned in pricing the car about any rebate check.
I didn't say anything and I know I should have at least asked if that
money was from Ford to the dealer then why did they send it to him with
my name on it?

Thinking back I think that check should have been mine and I was
foolish enough to sign it over to the dealer.

I am planning to buy another new car soon and I dread the negotiating I
will have to do to buy one.

Any suggestions on how to get the best deal with poor negotiating
skills?

Any suggestions on a better group to ask these questions?

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> The first time I bought a car I ordered it with the options I wanted.
> We agreed on the price and when the car arrived at the dealership I had
> a cashiers check for the car.
>
> The dealer had a rebate check that was issued from Ford with my name on
> it. He asked me to sign the check and took put it in the cash drawer.
>
> Nothing was ever mentioned in pricing the car about any rebate check.
> I didn't say anything and I know I should have at least asked if that
> money was from Ford to the dealer then why did they send it to him with
> my name on it?
>
> Thinking back I think that check should have been mine and I was
> foolish enough to sign it over to the dealer.
>
> I am planning to buy another new car soon and I dread the negotiating I
> will have to do to buy one.
>
> Any suggestions on how to get the best deal with poor negotiating
> skills?
>
> Any suggestions on a better group to ask these questions?
>

Go to www.edmunds.com and configure the car the way you want it. Click on
the "current offers" link to see what rebates are being offered for your
area. Offer $100 over invoice minus the rebate. You'll still be paying a
little more than you should, but it saves the hassle. You'll be in and out
in under 30 minutes (in most cases). If you still want to haggle, that's a
good starting number.

> Any suggestions on how to get the best deal with poor negotiating
> skills?

You can possibly save up to a third if you instead consider buying a
slightly used car from a private seller. The remaining warranty will still
be good too. Have it inspected if you aren't capable of doing it yourself.

Delaers are simply the worst place to buy a car. Let someone else take the
hit.

> wrote in message
oups.com...

> Any suggestions on how to get the best deal with poor negotiating
> skills?

http://www.fightingchance.com

HIGHLY recommended. Also, make a trip to your bookstore and buy some books
on how to buy a car. The best one I know of is "Car Buyer's and Leaser's
Negotiating Bible" by William Bragg. I gotta tell ya, it was fun turning
the tables on car salesmen. From the moment we stepped onto the lot to the
moment we signed the papers, 90 minutes time--and that included a 45 minute
test drive! Not to mention which we paid less than $300 over factory
invoice. Can you dig it?

One other tip: see those two things past your legs and ankles, covered up by
shoes and socks? Those are your absolute best negotiating tools. Use them
for fun and profit. They work.

> http://www.fightingchance.com
>
> HIGHLY recommended. Also, make a trip to your
> bookstore and buy some books on how to buy a car.
>The best one I know of is "Car Buyer's and Leaser's
> Negotiating Bible" by William Bragg.

Don't forget _Don't Get Taken Every Time_ by Remar Sutton. The latest
edition(s) are worth a look even if you read it back in the day --
there's an interesting new chapter on how dealers as well as consumers
use the Internet. It also goes through scenarios that describe how
different personality types and demographic groups get ripped on the
individual deal and get permanently upside-down over time.

Sutton is also very big on private-party sales within your network of
family and friends and neighbors as a good way to pick up a quality
*used* car. The catches, of course, are that you have to be flexible
about make/model/year and the timing of the purchase so as to take
advantage of what's available, and that it'll often have to be a cash
deal. But I must say that I've gotten the most satisfactory deals in
this manner.

But let's suppose you want a new car. The advice in this thread
should, if not make you a budding professional shopper and/or business
negotiator, at least give you a concrete idea of how best to proceed
and what specifically to look out for.

If after doing your homework you decide you wouldn't find it amusing
and rewarding to sally forth and try to best the car sharks at their
own game, you might try auto brokers -- independent ones, services of
the warehouse shopping clubs, whatever. (Don't forget to perform due
diligence on them first, of course.) The broker has to make money out
of this somewhere, so you won't get the rock bottom price that you
yourself could hypothetically extract by using well-honed negotiating
skills upon a hungry dealer. But if the broker is reputable and
talented, it should still be a substantially below-sticker price and a
low-hassle experience.

Another important way to keep both cost and hassle to a minimum is to
have in place your own financing arrangements through your own bank,
credit union, or whatnot before ever making contact with a dealer.

Best of luck,
--Joe

"Ad absurdum per aspera" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>> http://www.fightingchance.com
>>
>> HIGHLY recommended. Also, make a trip to your
>> bookstore and buy some books on how to buy a car.
>>The best one I know of is "Car Buyer's and Leaser's
>> Negotiating Bible" by William Bragg.
>
> Don't forget _Don't Get Taken Every Time_ by Remar Sutton. The latest
> edition(s) are worth a look even if you read it back in the day --
> there's an interesting new chapter on how dealers as well as consumers
> use the Internet. It also goes through scenarios that describe how
> different personality types and demographic groups get ripped on the
> individual deal and get permanently upside-down over time.

I have this book also; should have mentioned it. Thanks!

> Sutton is also very big on private-party sales within your network of
> family and friends and neighbors as a good way to pick up a quality
> *used* car. The catches, of course, are that you have to be flexible
> about make/model/year and the timing of the purchase so as to take
> advantage of what's available, and that it'll often have to be a cash
> deal. But I must say that I've gotten the most satisfactory deals in
> this manner.

More excellent advice.

> If after doing your homework you decide you wouldn't find it amusing
> and rewarding to sally forth and try to best the car sharks at their
> own game, you might try auto brokers -- independent ones, services of
> the warehouse shopping clubs, whatever. (Don't forget to perform due
> diligence on them first, of course.) The broker has to make money out
> of this somewhere, so you won't get the rock bottom price that you
> yourself could hypothetically extract by using well-honed negotiating
> skills upon a hungry dealer. But if the broker is reputable and
> talented, it should still be a substantially below-sticker price and a
> low-hassle experience.

One technique to use on sales hawks also works on brokers: the old 20/80
rule. 20% of car sales customers generate 80% of the profits. So tell
them that they'll make a sale but not a huge commission. If they want to
move a vehicle today, they can do it with you--they can make a lot of money
with their next sales. If they balk, don't argue. Just say "Okay," and
walk away. Then watch them chase you back into the booth to make the sale.

> Another important way to keep both cost and hassle to a minimum is to
> have in place your own financing arrangements through your own bank,
> credit union, or whatnot before ever making contact with a dealer.

Shopping within a specific budget and the money in your pocket (and outta
sight of the sales hawks)--yet more excellent advice. Joe, you rock.

> Best of luck,
> --Joe
>

On 8 Mar 2005 11:15:59 -0800, "Ad absurdum per aspera"
> wrote:

>Sutton is also very big on private-party sales within your network of
>family and friends and neighbors as a good way to pick up a quality
>*used* car. The catches, of course, are that you have to be flexible
>about make/model/year and the timing of the purchase so as to take
>advantage of what's available, and that it'll often have to be a cash
>deal. But I must say that I've gotten the most satisfactory deals in
>this manner.

Personal opinion:
Never, ever, sell a used car to a friend/relative.
It's like loaning money to a friend/relative.
Be prepared to lose either the car/money or the friend/relative.

Or, as in the case of my own experience, *always* *ALWAYS* get a note
(contract) outlining the rules.

If you *give* the car to a friend/relative, it's almost as bad. The
car probably has problems (otherwise you'd sell it),and those problems
may come back to haunt.

Like I said, personal opinion.

--
Bill Funk
Change "g" to "a"

In article . com>,
Ad absurdum per aspera > wrote:
>Sutton is also very big on private-party sales within your network of
>family and friends and neighbors as a good way to pick up a quality
>*used* car. The catches, of course, are that you have to be flexible
>about make/model/year and the timing of the purchase so as to take
>advantage of what's available, and that it'll often have to be a cash
>deal.

Of course, you also have to have family, friends, and/or neighbors
who take care of their cars. There are some people I know whom I
would not buy a used car from, based on the condition of their cars.

Though if you do know someone who takes good care of his/her cars,
buying his/her used car may be advantageous due to the known good
history, compared to the less known or unknown history of a typical
used car.

--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Timothy J. Lee
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