GT or not?

On Jun 6, 12:12 pm, "caroline" > wrote:
> "compwrench" wrote
>
>
>
> > On Jun 5, 5:40 pm, "caroline" wrote:
> >> "Neil - Usenet" wrote
>
> >> > Plonk up some pics :-)
>
> >> Hi Neil
>
> >> Some pics he
>
> >>http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l2...psy/donor%20ca...
>
> >>http://i97.photobucket.com/albums/l2...psy/donor%20ca...
>
> >> I *did* say it was a scrapper didn't I... *LOL*
> > Looks restorable to me! ;-)
>
> > Scott S.
>
> *ROFL* maybe for the very brave or stupid <grin> Those pics show the pretty
> bits.
>
> However....might be feeling brave after I've finished the one I *am*
> actually restoring...and then I maybe stupid enough to look at what's left
> of the donor cars... ;o)
>
> Any thoughts on whether its a GT or not?

Sorry, no. I don't know enough about the GT to be able to tell. How
about the VIN, was it a special model that might have a specific VIN
prefix?

On Thu, 07 Jun 2007 00:38:50 +0200, Berg wrote:

> Tricky wrote:
>> Shouldn't the GT have coild spring front suspenison ?
>>
>> Rich
>>
>>
>> caroline wrote:
>>> Bought a scrapper beetle as a donor for my resto project last week.
>>> Bargain at ?50.
>>>
>>> But a few aspects of it have me scratching my head in confusion.
>>>
>>> Firstly its Tomato Red...was this a GT-only colour, or would it have
>>> been on other beetles in the same year too? If its a GT only colour,
>>> that ticks the GT box.
>>> Its a '73, built December '72...so that bit ticks the GT box also.
>>> It has tan doorcards...that apparently ticks the GT box.
>>> It came with GT wheels....that may tick the GT box, but easily swapped.
>>> It has an AB code gearbox, which with a little investigation was on
>>> 1300 beetles upto 1970. So clearly not the gearbox this bug started
>>> life with, and perhaps a replacement GT box wasn't available when the
>>> first gbox died?
>>> Has drum brakes on the front. These could have been changed by a PO,
>>> but why would you replace disk brakes with drum brakes?
>>> Has a different dash to the other '73 scrapper I bought, more modern
>>> looking?
>>> No rear wings on it, so don't know if it had elephant's foot lights or
>>> standard lights?
>>> No engine lid either.
>>> Curiouser, and curiouser, inside it we found the makings of a
>>> twin-port 1600 engine (AS41), which most definitely ticks the GT box.
>>>
>>> So what do you reckon...a lot of co-incidences? Or a genuine GT that
>>> got messed about with by one of more POs?
>>>
>>> The paint looks to be the paint it came out of the factory with....all
>>> the finicky bits are the same colour, inside and out, inside doors,
>>> under door cards etc. Unless a PO did a totally huge respray on it?
>>> But then if that kind of job WAS done on it, I'm surprised I found it
>>> in the condition I did, absolutely rotten...utterly utterly rotten.
>>> Can I emphasise how rotten and unloved this bog has been in the last I
>>> don;t know how many years...
>>>
>>> Would welcome thoughts on the identity of my tomato red '73 bug...and
>>> any thoughts on 100% identifying it as GT using something that PO
>>> couldn't have changed.
>>>
>
> Not if it is the same as the 1300S, the fastest(can one say that?) stock
> bug ever produced..
>
> I have all the running gear in my oval -56 "Fellatio" from a 1300S, will
> do close to 100Mph all stock parts except ignition.
>
> J.

OK

GT Beetle distinguishing features:

Front disc brakes
Brown door cards
Brown cord seats
Black tray over front of tunnel
Black engine cover rain guard
Elephant foot rear lights
Different gear ratios
Standard front beam with disc brakes
Standard 1600 engine - single carb only
Badged 130S, but UK dealer re-badged GT Beetle - black badge
Gear lever slotted cover and wood knob.

How many of these can you tick?

What does it say on the V5?

All the best

Tony

"Tony Bennett" wrote
> OK
>
> GT Beetle distinguishing features:
>
> Front disc brakes

Currently drum brakes

> Brown door cards

Yes

> Brown cord seats

Yes

> Black tray over front of tunnel

Not there, possibly missing....lots of nits are missing or yet to be
discovered in various bags and boxes strewn about inside either this beetle
or its scrap cousin that came with it.

> Black engine cover rain guard

??? If its what I think it is (never heard it called that before) it would
be on the engine lid, yes? Which is missing ;o(

> Elephant foot rear lights

No rear wings

> Different gear ratios

Not the original gearbox, gearbox wrong for car year so clearly a
replacement

> Standard front beam with disc brakes

Standard front beam, but drum brakes

> Standard 1600 engine - single carb only

Found a twinport 1600 inside it (not installed in it) crankcase in front
passenger footwell, pistons and barrels and various other bits bagged up on
or around the backseat.

> Badged 130S, but UK dealer re-badged GT Beetle - black badge

No engine lid, so no badges

> Gear lever slotted cover and wood knob.

Currently covered in electrical tape (no idea why don't ask) I'll peel it
off and have a look for ye? Car is in storage now, and not outside my door
anymore alas.

> How many of these can you tick?

Some and some <grin> Tell me, where any other beetles in that year sent out
in Tomato Red colour with tan door cards etc?

> What does it say on the V5?

Don't have one, but applying for replacement documents isn't so hard in
Ireland, but won't necessarily have accurate info, ie replacement docs won't
necessarily carry all the info that original docs would. Just general make,
model, chassis number and reg number, That'd be about it.

Thanks for your post, hopefully we can get to the bottom of the mystery
someday.

On Mon, 25 Jun 2007 20:07:12 +0100, caroline wrote:

> "Tony Bennett" wrote
>> OK
>>
>> GT Beetle distinguishing features:
>>
>> Front disc brakes
>
> Currently drum brakes
>
>> Brown door cards
>
> Yes
>
>> Brown cord seats
>
> Yes
>
>> Black tray over front of tunnel
>
> Not there, possibly missing....lots of nits are missing or yet to be
> discovered in various bags and boxes strewn about inside either this beetle
> or its scrap cousin that came with it.
>
>> Black engine cover rain guard
>
> ??? If its what I think it is (never heard it called that before) it would
> be on the engine lid, yes? Which is missing ;o(
>
>> Elephant foot rear lights
>
> No rear wings
>
>> Different gear ratios
>
> Not the original gearbox, gearbox wrong for car year so clearly a
> replacement
>
>> Standard front beam with disc brakes
>
> Standard front beam, but drum brakes
>
>> Standard 1600 engine - single carb only
>
> Found a twinport 1600 inside it (not installed in it) crankcase in front
> passenger footwell, pistons and barrels and various other bits bagged up on
> or around the backseat.
>
>> Badged 130S, but UK dealer re-badged GT Beetle - black badge
>
> No engine lid, so no badges
>
>> Gear lever slotted cover and wood knob.
>
> Currently covered in electrical tape (no idea why don't ask) I'll peel it
> off and have a look for ye? Car is in storage now, and not outside my door
> anymore alas.
>
>> How many of these can you tick?
>
> Some and some <grin> Tell me, where any other beetles in that year sent out
> in Tomato Red colour with tan door cards etc?
>
>> What does it say on the V5?
>
> Don't have one, but applying for replacement documents isn't so hard in
> Ireland, but won't necessarily have accurate info, ie replacement docs won't
> necessarily carry all the info that original docs would. Just general make,
> model, chassis number and reg number, That'd be about it.
>
> Thanks for your post, hopefully we can get to the bottom of the mystery
> someday.

I think tomato red was only used on GT. Is the aluminium plate with
colour code present. It should be under the bonnet, at the front by the
spare wheel well. It will also have the chassis number. If so does it
match the chassis number on the pan. Could the car have been re-bodied?

Tony

The UK version of the GT Beetle had a few unique features and was a
limited edition of 2500.

Gearbox had a 3.875:1 ratio - same as the 1303S and 1600 Karmann Ghia
'box, but swingaxle.
1600 engine
Elephant feet rear lights
GT wheels 4.5"
GT Gearstick
GT padded dashboard
GT seats - two tone brown/beige
Front disc brakes
Paint was either Tomato Red, Lemon Yellow or Apple Green
It was badged either as a 1300S or GT Beetle.
Kamei tunnel tray

Out of interest, Tomato Red was also known as Phoenix Red - a popular
1303 colour.

caroline wrote:
> [...]

Given the long list of missing parts, it does not matter if it was a GT.
The GT was nothing special when new. What you have is a basketcase.

On 27 Jun, 14:54, John Boy > wrote:
> caroline wrote:
> > [...]
>
> Given the long list of missing parts, it does not matter if it was a GT.
> The GT was nothing special when new. What you have is a basketcase.

It doesn't really look too bad... you can still see the rear bumper
mounts!

"John Boy" wrote
> Given the long list of missing parts, it does not matter if it was a GT.
> The GT was nothing special when new. What you have is a basketcase.

Thanks SO much for your opinion ;o)

Fortunately I bought it as a scrapper....and what I can get off it that is
of use to the beetle I'm restoring is valued far higher than the few pennies
I gave for it out of politeness.

A lot of people would differ with your opinion on the GT. But personally I'm
not too bothered, just curious. Its highly unlikely that it'll be restored.
The other scrapper that came with it (I paid pennies and got TWO!) is in
better condition, so if I plan another resto after I finish my '70, then I'd
chose the other one anyway.
Am truly just curious as to whether its a GT or not, and its not relevant to
the future of the car. If it IS a GT, and if there WERE only 2500 produced
then its kinda sad it ended up in the state its in, but then I guess some
folks don't care about their bugs ;o)
Either way, as well as TWO beetles for pennies I also got a 1600 twinport
thrown in which the seller didn't know was there, and I didn't find until I
got them home...not such a bad deal huh!

caroline wrote:
> "John Boy" wrote
>> Given the long list of missing parts, it does not matter if it was a GT.
>> The GT was nothing special when new. What you have is a basketcase.
>
> Thanks SO much for your opinion ;o)
>
> Fortunately I bought it as a scrapper....and what I can get off it that is
> of use to the beetle I'm restoring is valued far higher than the few pennies
> I gave for it out of politeness.

In my experience in the USA (and I used to live in England), one can buy
a super clean, unrusted Bug for less than it costs to 'restore' a
scrapper. Most so-called restos are given up half-finished wrecks that
leave the restorer just more broke.

Best of luck.

> [...] If it IS a GT, and if there WERE only 2500 produced
> then its kinda sad it ended up in the state its in,

Some things are rare because when new, they weren't worth any more than
the rest.

"John Boy" wrote
> caroline wrote:
>> "John Boy" wrote
>>> Given the long list of missing parts, it does not matter if it was a GT.
>>> The GT was nothing special when new. What you have is a basketcase.
>>
>> Thanks SO much for your opinion ;o)
>>
>> Fortunately I bought it as a scrapper....and what I can get off it that
>> is of use to the beetle I'm restoring is valued far higher than the few
>> pennies I gave for it out of politeness.
>
> In my experience in the USA (and I used to live in England), one can buy a
> super clean, unrusted Bug for less than it costs to 'restore' a scrapper.

Aren't you lucky ;o)
FWIW the one I'm actually restoring is far from scrap and is Irish-built,
something worth keeping on the road IMHO. The white one (the 2nd scrapper
in the 2 car deal) is also Irish-built...so should I feel like another
project soon after I finish the '70 that would definitely be the one I'd
have a go at.

Most so-called restos are given up half-finished wrecks that
> leave the restorer just more broke.

It always helps when you know what you're doing ;o)