Why you should remove the negative battery terminal before doing ANYTHING!!!!

Auto/Truck batteries do not have any electricity in them.Dry cell and
gell batteries don't either.They have lead and calcium plates.Some
batteries have antimony plates in them.Basically, they are plastic cases
with the plates and top post or side post, some batteries have top and
side post.The acid in the batteries is diluted (with water) sulphuric
acid.Pure sulphuric acid has a chemical burn equal to about 735 degrees
fahrenheit.I have had some of it (pure) on me before when I worked at a
factory that manufactured auto/truck/lawnmower/MG 6 volt car batteies.I
guarantee you, you do not ever want to get so much as one single drop of
pure undiluted sulphuric battery acid on your skin.You wouldn't believe
what happens! There are also specialized batteries for other
purposes/uses.The battery in my van is about five years old.It doesn't
quite cut the mustard anymore.About four hours ago, my sister came over
here to take to the Auto Zone store so I could buy a new battery.New
Valuecraft battery 49.99.Core charge $12.00.Subtotal $61.99.Total Tax
$4.34.Total $66.33.
Tomorrow, I will take my old battery to the Auto Zone store.
cuhulin

On about 92 and up:

The dome light is connected to the Body Control Module.

RK
"jim beam" > wrote in message
...
> Tony Hwang wrote:
>> Gary L. Burnore wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 02:17:38 GMT, Tony Hwang > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> jim beam wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hachiroku wrote:
>>>>> <snip crap>
>>>>>
>>>>>> I had heard of this before; I can't remember what the car was, but
>>>>>> someone
>>>>>> shorted out the ECU replacing the dome light...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> no way - the ecu's not even connected to the dome light. and they're
>>>>> electrically protected against all kinds of "user error", including
>>>>> battery reversal, over-voltage, dead shorts and static. short of
>>>>> direct lightning strike, water damage, or fire, none of which have a
>>>>> single damned thing to do with dome lights, the ecu's not going
>>>>> anywhere and it's /certainly/ not going to be fubared by a bulb
>>>>> change.
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>> No way? If short caused a surge in the electrical system,
>>>
>>>
>>> You're kidding right?
>> Hi,
>> Probably you don't even know basic Ohm's law or Kirchoff's or
>> Tevnin Norton's theorem, etc. If you want to debate, email me directly.
>> Let's compare our CV first.
>
> tony, this is usenet - "credentials" don't mean ****. just stick to the
> facts.
>
> fact 1 - batteries don't "surge". period. some [reactive] peripherals
> can do it, unless protected. in cars, they all are. dome lights are not
> reactive.
>
> fact 2 - ohmic behavior dictates that battery voltage drops as current
> increases, not the other way around.
>
> fact 3 - ecu's are "idiot proofed". per #1, a dome light has no reaction
> that could possibly cause a problem, even if the ecu was unprotected.
>
> conclusion: either address reality or move on.

I prefer my old vehicles, without that fancy new car computer/electronic
stuff.I know how to work on my old vehicles (1914 Ford T Model Runabout
Roadster, 1948 Willys Jeep, 1961 made in Germany Hercules Moped and my
1978 Dodge van) and keep them running and I already have all of the
tools I need.I can pay cash for a brand new vehicle, if I want to.I
hardly go anywhere anymore, mostly a three miles round trip to the food
store once every couple of weeks.I have no need or desire for a new
vehicle.
I also own and use my Velocity Micro ProMagix desktop computer I bought
for $1,440.00 four years ago.
cuhulin

On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 01:54:05 +0000, Refinish King wrote:

> On about 92 and up:
>
> The dome light is connected to the Body Control Module.
>
> RK

Hey, RK, how ya doin'?

I wanted to ask you something a while ago, but I forget.

At any rate, right. The DL is connected to the BCM, which MAY have a
connection to the ECM.


> "jim beam" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Tony Hwang wrote:
>>> Gary L. Burnore wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 02:17:38 GMT, Tony Hwang > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> jim beam wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hachiroku wrote:
>>>>>> <snip crap>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I had heard of this before; I can't remember what the car was, but
>>>>>>> someone
>>>>>>> shorted out the ECU replacing the dome light...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> no way - the ecu's not even connected to the dome light. and
>>>>>> they're electrically protected against all kinds of "user error",
>>>>>> including battery reversal, over-voltage, dead shorts and static.
>>>>>> short of direct lightning strike, water damage, or fire, none of
>>>>>> which have a single damned thing to do with dome lights, the ecu's
>>>>>> not going anywhere and it's /certainly/ not going to be fubared by a
>>>>>> bulb change.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> No way? If short caused a surge in the electrical system,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You're kidding right?
>>> Hi,
>>> Probably you don't even know basic Ohm's law or Kirchoff's or Tevnin
>>> Norton's theorem, etc. If you want to debate, email me directly. Let's
>>> compare our CV first.
>>
>> tony, this is usenet - "credentials" don't mean ****. just stick to the
>> facts.
>>
>> fact 1 - batteries don't "surge". period. some [reactive] peripherals
>> can do it, unless protected. in cars, they all are. dome lights are
>> not reactive.
>>
>> fact 2 - ohmic behavior dictates that battery voltage drops as current
>> increases, not the other way around.
>>
>> fact 3 - ecu's are "idiot proofed". per #1, a dome light has no
>> reaction that could possibly cause a problem, even if the ecu was
>> unprotected.
>>
>> conclusion: either address reality or move on.

Hachiroku ãƒ�ãƒ�ãƒ*ク wrote:

> On Mon, 12 Nov 2007 01:54:05 +0000, Refinish King wrote:
>
>
>>On about 92 and up:
>>
>>The dome light is connected to the Body Control Module.
>>
>>RK
>
>
> Hey, RK, how ya doin'?
>
> I wanted to ask you something a while ago, but I forget.
>
> At any rate, right. The DL is connected to the BCM, which MAY have a
> connection to the ECM.
>
>


Boy, am I glad that my newest vehicle is an '83...

JT

Steve W. wrote:
>
>> tony, this is usenet - "credentials" don't mean ****. just stick to
>> the facts.
>>
>> fact 1 - batteries don't "surge". period. some [reactive]
>> peripherals can do it, unless protected. in cars, they all are. dome
>> lights are not reactive.
>
> No but a direct short could cause a problem in the item shorted. In the
> case of some vehicles that could be the BCM if they use it for things
> like an interior light timer/dimmer (close door and dome light stays on
> for a bit) Shorting that circuit cause problems.

rubbish.


>
>>
>> fact 2 - ohmic behavior dictates that battery voltage drops as current
>> increases, not the other way around.
>
> Yes BUT take a chunk of wire and toss it across the battery. Measure the
> battery voltage. It likely won't cause a voltage drop as it heats up and
> melts.

"likely"??? dude, it /definitely/ does! grade school science class.


>
>>
>> fact 3 - ecu's are "idiot proofed". per #1, a dome light has no
>> reaction that could possibly cause a problem, even if the ecu was
>> unprotected.
>
> VERY WRONG. ECUs are easy to kill if you are not paying attention. My
> SOP in the body shop is to pull the ECU on anything that rolls in for
> panel work. One good zap from a welder can kill the ECU without being
> near it.

eh? welding is a whole different ball game to shorting a fuse protected
light circuit. welding is done at voltages and currents in excess of
those seen in vehicle operation, and is accompanies by all kinds of
radio frequency noise, both from the spark and the welder, depending on
welder type! yes, it's good to disconnect the ecu while welding. no,
shorting a light circuit doesn't replicate those conditions.


>
>>
>> conclusion: either address reality or move on.
>
>

Refinish King wrote:
> On about 92 and up:
>
> The dome light is connected to the Body Control Module.

yes, which is not the ecu!


>
> RK
> "jim beam" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Tony Hwang wrote:
>>> Gary L. Burnore wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 02:17:38 GMT, Tony Hwang > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> jim beam wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hachiroku wrote:
>>>>>> <snip crap>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I had heard of this before; I can't remember what the car was, but
>>>>>>> someone
>>>>>>> shorted out the ECU replacing the dome light...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> no way - the ecu's not even connected to the dome light. and they're
>>>>>> electrically protected against all kinds of "user error", including
>>>>>> battery reversal, over-voltage, dead shorts and static. short of
>>>>>> direct lightning strike, water damage, or fire, none of which have a
>>>>>> single damned thing to do with dome lights, the ecu's not going
>>>>>> anywhere and it's /certainly/ not going to be fubared by a bulb
>>>>>> change.
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> No way? If short caused a surge in the electrical system,
>>>>
>>>> You're kidding right?
>>> Hi,
>>> Probably you don't even know basic Ohm's law or Kirchoff's or
>>> Tevnin Norton's theorem, etc. If you want to debate, email me directly.
>>> Let's compare our CV first.
>> tony, this is usenet - "credentials" don't mean ****. just stick to the
>> facts.
>>
>> fact 1 - batteries don't "surge". period. some [reactive] peripherals
>> can do it, unless protected. in cars, they all are. dome lights are not
>> reactive.
>>
>> fact 2 - ohmic behavior dictates that battery voltage drops as current
>> increases, not the other way around.
>>
>> fact 3 - ecu's are "idiot proofed". per #1, a dome light has no reaction
>> that could possibly cause a problem, even if the ecu was unprotected.
>>
>> conclusion: either address reality or move on.
>
>

On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 02:17:38 GMT, Tony Hwang > wrote:

>No way? If short caused a surge in the electrical system, anything is
>possible.

Maybe he reversed the polarity of the Bogon Flux ?

On Sun, 11 Nov 2007 21:26:28 GMT, Tony Hwang > wrote:

>Tevnin Norton's theorem, etc. If you want to debate, email me directly.

Hey, I can even _spell_ Thevenin

All your base are belong to us!
cuhulin