Which electric car is best?

Dan Bloomquist wrote:

> Lawrence Glickman wrote:
>
> > If that's The Future, I'm glad I won't be around to see it.
>
> About the smartest comment I've seen on usenet.

Heck - look at the cars in 'Brazil' !

http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006...cars_for_c.php

Graham

Joe Fischer wrote:

> On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 04:55:52 +0100, Eeyore
> > wrote:
>
> >>.......
> >> In the case of the Riva it appears to use Lead Acid batteries which
> >> are heavier and of lower energy density than Li Ion or NIMH.
> >> If you are thinking of buying an EV , make sure you get some info on
> >> how long the batteries will last , and what their replacement cost is.
> >
> >I couldn't agree more.
>
> There is no reason to think of replacing the whole
> battery pack at once, although when batteries are in parallel,
> they need to be close to being "matched".

You're drivelling.

Graham

On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 05:54:22 +0100, Eeyore
> wrote:

>Joe Fischer wrote:
>> On Tue, 10 Oct 2006 04:55:52 +0100, Eeyore
>> > wrote:
>> >>.......
>> >> In the case of the Riva it appears to use Lead Acid batteries which
>> >> are heavier and of lower energy density than Li Ion or NIMH.
>> >> If you are thinking of buying an EV , make sure you get some info on
>> >> how long the batteries will last , and what their replacement cost is.
>> >
>> >I couldn't agree more.
>>
>> There is no reason to think of replacing the whole
>> battery pack at once, although when batteries are in parallel,
>> they need to be close to being "matched".
>
>You're drivelling.
>Graham

http://rcsource.hobbypeople.net/faqs/matchedb.htm

Joe Fischer

Eeyore wrote:
> Anthony Matonak wrote:
wrote:
>>
>>>... But surely someone
>>>has done a 'round up' of the current models?
>>
>>There are no current models. No one makes them.
>
> Oh but there are !
> And they mostly look like really really bad jokes except the mega-bucks
> ones.

There are variations on golf carts that are electric vehicles.
Sometimes they are called 'neighborhood electric vehicles'.
They are usually limited in speed to something like 25 to 30 mph.
They are not legal on any road posted over (if I recall) 40 mph.
Their range is usually limited to around 20 to 25 miles and their
safety features are non-existent.

I do not consider these to be proper cars. They are not legal on
any highway, freeway or most major streets here in Los Angeles.

There are some concept cars, prototypes and 'any day now' cars
which are very expensive but workable with both good speed, range
and acceleration. As yet, only a handful of these have been built
and none are being sold to ordinary mortals today.

There were a couple of models made previously, the Toyota Rav4,
the GM EV1, some Ford Ranger trucks and the like. Only a handful
of them still exist and no one makes them anymore.

Simply put, no one makes a street (freeway) legal electric car.
The nearest you can get is to convert a hybrid like the Prius
into a 'plug in hybrid' by installing larger batteries and misc
other parts.

Anthony

Joe Fischer wrote:
....
> There is no reason to think of replacing the whole
> battery pack at once, although when batteries are in parallel,
> they need to be close to being "matched".
....
With more advanced battery management systems, such as used in
the T-Zero, smaller battery packs can be managed individually.
Then individual packs can be replaced as needed without having
to match them to the entire assembly.

Anthony

> I'm interested in going electric, since all the trips
> that I make are short and on local roads, and
> electricity is so cheap.
>
> I am curious to learn whether any one electric car
> has stood out as being both a good value.
> Needless to say, Consumer Reports has never
> reviewed electric cars. But surely someone
> has done a 'round up' of the current models?
>
> Or should I buy a kit to convert an existing
> car to electric? If so, which kit is best?
> I assume I would buy a VW Rabbit or similar
> for that.

In a view years, there will be many different
nice electric cars or plug in hybrids.

That's all because of new battery technology.

Lithium Polymer is about 8 times better
for use in vehicles than lead acid.

You could use different approaches to this

Toyota Prius+

That's a Prius converted with 9 kWh
Lithium Phosphat batteries from
http://www.valence.com to a plug in hybrid.

I heared the conversion is about $9000

Electric range around 50km with 20%
remaining in the battery.

After this, it's just a normal Prius.


Or has it to be under all cirumstances a car?

If You are in a urbn area where all Your ways
are with low speed, the cheapest approach
to electric vehicles would be an electric
scooter like the E-Max S. Here in Germany
just for 2300.-EUR

Or just coming on the market, a maxi scooter
with nice performance

http://auto.pege.org/2006-ever-monac...axiscooter.htm


--
Roland Mösl
http://car.pege.org cars and traffic
http://live.pege.org building and live
http://www.pege.org

On Mon, 09 Oct 2006 22:52:42 -0700, Anthony Matonak
> wrote:

>Joe Fischer wrote:
>> There is no reason to think of replacing the whole
>> battery pack at once, although when batteries are in parallel,
>> they need to be close to being "matched".
>...
>With more advanced battery management systems, such as used in
>the T-Zero, smaller battery packs can be managed individually.
>Then individual packs can be replaced as needed without having
>to match them to the entire assembly.
>Anthony

That has to be the best looking car around.

http://www.acpropulsion.com/

Joe Fischer

>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I'm interested in going electric, since all the trips
>>> that I make are short and on local roads, and
>>> electricity is so cheap.
>>
>>The electricity may be cheap but the cars aren't.
>>
>>This one is affordable though.
>>http://www.revaindia.com/
>>
>>Graham
>>
>
> The major problem with all electric cars that Ive seen so far is that
> whilst the car has very low running costs, electricity is cheap, the
> batteries needed to give the car any useable range arnt.
> The most common batteries used in EVs are either Lithium Ion or
> Nickel Metal Hydride , both of which are very good hi energy density
> and good performance , but limited life relataive to the life of the
> actual car.

Most current EVs have lead acid or NiCd

At Lithium Polymer, it seems the batteries will last longer than the cars

http://www.kokam.com/english/product/kokam_Lipo_01.html

> Most EV manufacturers are silent on how long the batteries will last
> and on how much they will cost to replace.
> From my experiance with fixing lap top computers which commonly use
> Lithium Ion batteries, average life is about 2 years, so if you are
> happy with having to replace your EVs battery every 2 years or so then
> go for it.

I have a 6 year old Lithium Ion in one of my older notebooks
at 60% original capacity


--
Roland Mösl
http://car.pege.org cars and traffic
http://live.pege.org building and live
http://www.pege.org

The best car I have seen so far has been the Tesla -->
http://www.teslamotors.com <-- !!

--
Bing Bang Boom Voila Done!
> wrote in message
ups.com...
> Hi all,
>
> I'm interested in going electric, since all the trips
> that I make are short and on local roads, and
> electricity is so cheap.
>
> I am curious to learn whether any one electric car
> has stood out as being both a good value.
> Needless to say, Consumer Reports has never
> reviewed electric cars. But surely someone
> has done a 'round up' of the current models?
>
> Or should I buy a kit to convert an existing
> car to electric? If so, which kit is best?
> I assume I would buy a VW Rabbit or similar
> for that.
>
> Thanks for any info.
>

wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> I'm interested in going electric, since all the trips
> that I make are short and on local roads, and
> electricity is so cheap.
>
> I am curious to learn whether any one electric car
> has stood out as being both a good value.
> Needless to say, Consumer Reports has never
> reviewed electric cars. But surely someone
> has done a 'round up' of the current models?
>
> Or should I buy a kit to convert an existing
> car to electric? If so, which kit is best?
> I assume I would buy a VW Rabbit or similar
> for that.
>
> Thanks for any info.

If you can find it:
http://www.autoindustry.co.uk/news/18-07-06_9

(This uses a Zebra liquid sodium nickel chloride battery. I thought
these had to run at high temperature, so I do wonder how they achieve
this.)

If you can afford it, there's the Tesla.

The best concept car I've seen is the PML Mini PHEV.
http://www.fastcar.co.uk/640_break_H...khoa2rmWw.html