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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
I am a member of a 'small' web forum that deals with all sorts of
subjects. One of the sections deals with gaming, and one of the members happens to be a Logitech employee. Over the last week or so he has been very kind to divulge information about the upcoming G25 wheel. I have been keeping an eye on the thread and snipping information that I think R.A.S. would find interesting and composing it. Now keep in mind I have no desire to get this fellow in trouble, so this information has been edited slightly from its original content. What follows is the snippings from the thread edited into a Question/Answer type post. *** Question : ...how powerful are the "high torque motors," because the logitech one that came out around the time of gt4 didn't whip my arms back into place like I would have hoped. Answer : I'm currently working on putting together hard numbers, so for now you'll have to be satisfied with generalities. The motors on the G25 produce a little more torque than the DFP's motor. However, since the G25's force mechanism is a single-reduction gear set rather than double- reduction, the inherent drag in the system is much lower, making the forces feel stronger. This has the added benefit of making the wheel drive much more quietly. *** Question : Can Logitech make a set of pedals that don't suck ass? Answer : We certainly tried pretty hard this time. They may not please everyone, but they are significantly improved over our previous products. *** Question : Expensive. Why? Answer : The features people want in a "good wheel" are expensive. This thing has a significant amount of steel in it - not to mention a leather wrapped wheel rim, shift knob, and shifter boot. It is expensive because it costs a lot to make a good wheel. *** Question : What I'm wondering is I've noticed in using the DFP for LFS that maybe because I have the forcefeedback turned up but the wheel is slower than hell to turn back around. I feel I really really have to turn it quite hard in order for me to save my car sometimes. Does this wheel do anything this? Also the pedals. I know you say they're modified so they can sit on carpet and on a hard surface but that's ********. I have tile in my bedroom and I spend a good portion of any race I run with them trying to make sure when I press on the gas the damned things don't go sliding away from me. How has that changed? Answer : The stuff I mentioned above about single reduction vs double reduction is the answer to your first question. The wheel turns much more smoothly and quietly because it doesn't have two sets of gears to go through, and the motors are only turning about half as fast as they were with the DFP. From a practical standpoint, in LFS it is MUCH easier to correct a slide than with the DFP, because you can turn the wheel much faster. When you turn the DFP really really fast it spins the FF motor at a very high rate. Motors use electricity to spin, and spinning a motor generates electricity. The drag you feel is partially the effect of generating electricity by spinning the motor. Additionally, if you spin it fast enough, you can generate enough to theoretically smoke components on the board. Beyond theoretically - on the original Formula Force wheel (the red rimmed one) one of our engineers found that he could actually burn out one of the resistors on the main board by turning the wheel too fast. So there is some safety circuitry in our wheels that throttles the maximum speed the wheel can be turned so that you don't break them. The pedals have rubber feet on them - nothing particularly special. It will help, though, that the pedals alone weigh approximately 8 pounds. *** Question : How will the wheel be mounted on the desk? Answer : The wheel has two clamp screws that are pretty similar to the DFP's. It's a much smaller footprint left to right because the shifter is on a separate module. It's similar front to back to the DFP. It's much smaller overall than the MOMO Racing wheel. The shifter module is about 1/3 the size of the wheel, but it does have a center clamp screw kind of like the one on the MOMO Racing. This is to prevent tipping. *** Question : Can you make a wheel that doesn't have garbage pedals this time? I barely used my DFP and now I get the ****ty brake calibration error. For what they cost a problem like that shouldn't exist at all. Answer : Okay - keeping in mind that I might be screwing up one or another of the electrical terms, here's the best answer I can offer: The G25's pedals use standard metal "can" pots and are designed such that the pots should last a significant amount of time. There is no easy way (you'd have to REALLY abuse them) to drive the pedals past their maximum range, as the pedals bottom out with steel pressing against steel. The pedals also have steel frames and arms that are held together with shoulder bolts that are pretty precisely cut. The pots are not connected to the pedal arm directly, so they will not receive any load nor will they be subjected to excess stress during whatever torsional movement you manage to put on the thing. The end result is that the pots should not see the same kind of electrical spiking that would confuse the autocalibration routine. Last thing - pots WILL wear out, regardless of how well they're protected and constructed. The G25's should be pretty easy to replace, though, as they're a much more standard part and the installation is much more straightforward than before. *** Question : It's a sweet looking wheel, but as someone who drives a manual transmission, I have to ask - why do pedals look like they're placed almost equally close to each other(and pretty tightly grouped too)? I mean, in a car, you have gas and brake pedals close together, since you operate them with one foot, and clutch is farther to the left. Answer : For reference, here is a picture of the brake with my foot on it. The gas and brake are actually pretty close together - the clutch is close to the brake by necessity - we couldn't make the pedals base be wider without the product costing significantly more. The wheel is currently set up for left foot clutch, right foot gas/brake and it works pretty well. Additionally, we know a lot of our customers like to left- foot brake, so we needed to maintain some space between them to accommodate that. *** Question : If I magically came across a G25 pedal set, would it be difficult/impossible to replace my MOMO pedals with it? Are the connectors entirely different, or perhaps just USB which would allow me to plug it into my PC instead of passing through the wheel first? Answer : If you are talking about the MOMO Racing (black) wheel, the gas and brake should work. The clutch will not. If you're talking about the MOMO Force (red) wheel, they are not complementary connectors. *** Question : Is this a worldwide release? Or will Europe get a delay again? Answer : It will release worldwide simultaneously. It can sometimes take longer in Europe for products to get from our warehouse into shops, though, so it may seem like it's being delayed there. *** Question : I know it's a bit of a stretch, but I'd really like adustable resistance on the pedals. With my old red MOMO wheel I did the ol' "put a squashball underneath the lever thing on the brake pedal" so the brake pedal didn't feel super loose. I understand that this would be hard to impliment, and i think it's in the more expensive BRD pedals and such - but is there any fesabile way this could start coming into mainstream wheels/pedal sets? Answer : The resistance isn't adjustable per se, but we're working on getting a spec sheet (white paper) out that will allow people to spec their own parts and change them out for performance that is preferable to their playstyle. Additionally, the potential to put a hard rubber insert in the brake is certainly present - it's just something that we would be hard-pressed to provide a warranty on due to the type of stresses that it would face. You won't consistently get a million cycles out of a rubber column, so we really can't ship something like that. Also, obviously, doing stuff like that voids your warranty, so do at your own risk etc etc. *** Question : Wow ... thanks a ton for all this info and for basically getting Logitech to make a wheel that is finally aimed at the people who actually play racing games. It'd be awesome if while you guys maybe didn't actually warranty the wheel if you make changes to it, but offer some of the white-spec parts yourself for people who want to change their wheel characteristics. Answer : We're probably not going to be in the business of selling replacement or modified parts, as encouraging people to do things that will void their warranty is very much not the way we do business. That being said, we'll probably have some basic specs on our own parts available, and we do know that people like Frex and ECCI have a lot of fun playing with our stuff... *** Question : (No question, just an 'update' post) Answer : There is a gear that connects solidly to the pedal arm, the pot is attached directly to the pedal frame, and a gear slips over the pot shaft and meshes with the arm gear. There is also a coil spring on the pot gear that pre-loads it by pushing against the bottom of the pedal frame. This means that there is no slack or backlash in the mechanism, as well as no load on the pot shaft other than in the direction it was intended to take load (i.e. around the axis of the shaft). All of this means that the pedals should be MUCH more accurate and reliable than before, and that replacement of the pots, should it become necessary, should be much more straightforward. ****** MRSisson -- LOAD "GPL",8 SEARCHING FOR GPL LOADING READY. RUN |
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#2
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
I am mailing a hard copy of this post to Logitech Corporate Headquarters.
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#3
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
rex roland wrote:
> I am mailing a hard copy of this post to Logitech Corporate Headquarters. Snitch |
#4
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
Every question I had about it has been answered now - thanks for the
info, Michael. I have myself on the contact list, and I'm just waiting on the email :-) Fletch |
#5
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
What, no one sticking up for the BRD Speed 7 FF wheel ? ;-)
Andi. "David Fletcher" > wrote in message ups.com... > Every question I had about it has been answered now - thanks for the > info, Michael. I have myself on the contact list, and I'm just waiting > on the email :-) > > Fletch > |
#6
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
Not a chance. Worst vaporware since the West Brothers. It's been "almost
ready" for years now. I don't doubt it's hard. I just hate it when products are announced and delayed for YEARS. -Larry "Andi Cole" > wrote in message ... > What, no one sticking up for the BRD Speed 7 FF wheel ? ;-) > > Andi. > > "David Fletcher" > wrote in message > ups.com... >> Every question I had about it has been answered now - thanks for the >> info, Michael. I have myself on the contact list, and I'm just waiting >> on the email :-) >> >> Fletch >> > > |
#7
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
Oh, and this thrustmaster Rallye GT thing is ****ing me off too.
I need a new wheel NOW dammit. I don't want to buy another cheap, black Momo. It's ok while it lasts, but it gets sloppy quick. Not very durable. The new Logi is, as everyone knows, some 6 months away. -Larry "Larry" > wrote in message news:E61dg.32785$fG3.7784@dukeread09... > Not a chance. Worst vaporware since the West Brothers. It's been "almost > ready" for years now. > > I don't doubt it's hard. I just hate it when products are announced and > delayed for YEARS. > > -Larry > > "Andi Cole" > wrote in message > ... >> What, no one sticking up for the BRD Speed 7 FF wheel ? ;-) >> >> Andi. >> >> "David Fletcher" > wrote in message >> ups.com... >>> Every question I had about it has been answered now - thanks for the >>> info, Michael. I have myself on the contact list, and I'm just waiting >>> on the email :-) >>> >>> Fletch >>> >> >> > > |
#8
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Logitech G25 Wheel Information
Larry wrote:
> Oh, and this thrustmaster Rallye GT thing is ****ing me off too. > > I need a new wheel NOW dammit. > > I don't want to buy another cheap, black Momo. It's ok while it lasts, but > it gets sloppy quick. Not very durable. > > The new Logi is, as everyone knows, some 6 months away. Well I think you and I are in roughly the same boat, since although I was able to order me a Rally GT, the courier company seem unable to get their act together and deliver the damn thing! So, maybe I'll get my hands on it eventually............. -- Phil http://www.usefilm.com/photographer/31307.html |
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