134a Refrigerant

"jeff" > wrote in message
news:10sDe.38984$Tx1.1895@trnddc03...
> BTW, as to your statement that "Nobody in the Industry" uses the term
> Freon as a generic descriptor for a family of chemical compounds roughly
> described as CFCs and HCFCs, here's a few links

your links mean _nothing_ to me. you do a google and think you know
something about refrigeration? lol. im in the industry every day, im
around others in the industry every day, and feel certain i know industry
terminology better than you and your little google. :-)


> Now, a hypothetical question: If a 70's vintage refrigerator leaks it's
> refrigerant in your basement how do you remove the freon?

the concentration of refrigerant in your basement wouldnt be enough to cause
you a problem. however, eventually the home hvac system would pull the
refrigerant upwards through the returns.


> I can put a fan in the window and rely on air turbulence to mix it all up
> and float it out the window?

certainly. youre only talking about lifting it a few feet.

--
Nathan W. Collier
http://InlineDiesel.com
http://7SlotGrille.com
http://UtilityOffRoad.com
http://BighornRefrigeration.com

Nathan W. Collier wrote:
> your links mean _nothing_ to me.

Yep, stick your fingers in your ears and say NaaaaNaaaaNaaaa....... I
Can't Hear you.......

> you do a google and think you know
> something about refrigeration? lol. im in the industry every day, im
> around others in the industry every day, and feel certain i know industry
> terminology better than you and your little google. :-)

The Google search terms were [Refrigeration Design Freon], and you know
what, the preponderance of the links came back using the term Freon
generically, as in offering Freon Compressors, and design expertise in
"Freon and Ammonia based refrigeration", and so on. Bottom line : On one
hand I have your unsupported assertion that *NOBODY* in the "Industry"
would ever use FREON in place of R-12 or dichlordiflouromethane.
Conversely I have provided 25 cites ( and that was just the tip of the
iceberg) showing common use of the term Freon for cfc based
refrigerants. Appeals to authority are not a valid argument technique,
especially when the authority is yourself.

>>Now, a hypothetical question: If a 70's vintage refrigerator leaks it's
>>refrigerant in your basement how do you remove the freon?
>
> the concentration of refrigerant in your basement wouldnt be enough to cause
> you a problem. however, eventually the home hvac system would pull the
> refrigerant upwards through the returns.

Yep, the same mechanism disburses freon in the atmosphere :-)

>>I can put a fan in the window and rely on air turbulence to mix it all up
>>and float it out the window?
>
> certainly. youre only talking about lifting it a few feet.
>

Ok, so I lift it a few feet. Then what? Will it magically fall again?
What prevents some portion of that which a fan lifted a couple of feet
from being further lifted by a breeze outside? You can't have your
argument both ways.

--
jeff

"jeff" > wrote in message
news:qpwDe.7703$JJ.3149@trnddc09...
> the preponderance of the links came back using the term Freon generically

i can do a google and provide you with dozens of links to sites who
celebrate adolph hitler as a hero. does that mean hitler was a hero? of
course not. "freon" is not used within the industry as anymore more than a
brand name. they may use it so that ignorant ****s like you can read along
and pretend you know something about it, but that doesnt make it proper.


> On one hand I have your unsupported assertion that *NOBODY* in the
> "Industry"
> would ever use FREON in place of R-12 or dichlordiflouromethane.
> Conversely I have provided 25 cites ( and that was just the tip of the
> iceberg) showing common use of the term Freon for cfc based refrigerants.
> Appeals to authority are not a valid argument technique, especially when
> the authority is yourself.

well i guess your little google search makes you the expert! :-)


> Yep, the same mechanism disburses freon in the atmosphere :-)

not comparable. youre talking about lifting scores of miles and thats not
going to happen from typical winds.


> Ok, so I lift it a few feet. Then what? Will it magically fall again?

mix oil and water in a glass. watch them settle. mix them up again and
guess what happens.....it "magically" falls again.


> What prevents some portion of that which a fan lifted a couple of feet
> from being further lifted by a breeze outside? You can't have your
> argument both ways.

the breeze doesnt blow from ground level to the ozone layer.

--
Nathan W. Collier
http://InlineDiesel.com
http://7SlotGrille.com
http://UtilityOffRoad.com
http://BighornRefrigeration.com

"Nathan W. Collier" > wrote in message =
...

....

> mix oil and water in a glass. watch them settle. mix them up again =
and=20
> guess what happens.....it "magically" falls again.

Tell us what happens when you don't stop mixing!
__
Steve
..

"L.W. (=DFill) Hughes III" > wrote in message =
...
> Stephen Cowell wrote:
> >=20
> > You don't remember this?
> > <>
> > >Just so you now know, the volume change created by mixing is their
> > >new density.=20
> > </>
> > One of your real gems!

> Any one else could given us a Volume a value of X, and the Change a
> value of Y then made an equation telling us whether they are =
multiplied,
> divided, added or subtracted.

???!!! Another gem! Why not square-rooted?

> I figured that's all you knew about our earth.=20

Bill... how old is the Earth?
__
Steve
..

OK, that's should be easy enough for even you. Give me a formula
with the volume and square root in the equation.
The earth is 4.55 billion years old (plus or minus about 1%).
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
http://www.billhughes.com/

Stephen Cowell wrote:
>
> Bill... how old is the Earth?
> __
> Steve
> .

"Nathan W. Collier" > wrote in message =
...
> "Stephen Cowell" > wrote in message=20
> .. .
> > No, you didn't show a lie. I claimed popular use.
>=20
> TRANSLATION --> "i tried to spin truth" :-)
>=20
> you lied, you are a liar.

Of course I am... otherwise, you'd be a damn
fool, and you can't be a damn fool, we know
that! Right?

>=20
> > Listen carefully... "otherwise there would be no reason not to =
replace
> > the HMC"... notice the mistake?
>=20
> lol you see you think this because your stupid, ignorant, and lying =
ass=20
> doesnt understand why an HMC is needed to begin with.

You still don't see your grammatical error!
What a dumbass!

Let's try baby talk...=20

must be low temp,
otherwise,
there would be no reason
*not* (this not doesn't belong)
to replace the HMC.

If you let the two 'nots' cancel,
you get:

must be low temp,
otherwise,
there would be a reason
to replace the HMC.

So if it's *high* ambient,
there is a reason to replace the HMC?

Jeez, dude... learn English.

> >> nope! that was my original statement to jeff. you jumped in so i =
gave=20
> >> you
> >> the criteria, specifically for everyone to see:
>=20
>> No, I don't accept that... the initial condition stands.
>=20
> my initial condition to you was -30 degrees as i have posted many =
times now.=20
> youre a liar stephen, no matter how hard you try to spin your bull**** =
ive=20
> clearly shown your lies for what they are.

Look, everybody! Nathan is a welch!

> > You can accuse me of lying all day,
>=20
> lol as if i need your permission to point out your lies, liar.

Plain as the nose on my face:
>great! now give me an alternative to replacing an HMC in a pinch.=20

No ambient specification. You, sir, are a charlatan.
=20
> >but you *did* try to slip in more conditions, we can
> >*all* see that.
>=20
> lol what we have all seen is my inital post to you which CLEARLY =
stated -30=20
> degrees. lie liar, it just wont get you anywhere. :-)

Ok, Mr. Welch... here's your post to me:

>and "in a pinch" means an alternative to "doing it right" to get you =
through=20
>temporarily when youre "in a pinch" (such as on a roof top on a -30 =
degree=20
>day).

The 'such as' condition is by no means limiting... it is
an example, that's why the 'such as' term was used.
Note that this post was not the original challenge,
only a response to an elaboration request. I do *not*
recognize it as being the defining post of the challenge.

Go ahead, spin some more. Call me a liar, too...
that's funny. Make goofy smileys while you're at
it... and why stop with the 'TRANSLATION'?

Just don't forget this one... it'll follow you to
your grave:

<>
you:
> more babble. i nailed you on it. i recognize my limitations and=20
> immediately own it. you lie, make excuses, and attempt to dazzle us =
with=20
> bull**** in hopes of hiding your blatent (sic) ignorance.

me:
You don't have a clue about your limitations... imagine you,
an HVAC tech, making pronouncements about atmospheric
science! That shows *extreme* hubris... you deserve what
you get.
</>

You deserve what you get... remember that.
__
Steve
..

"L.W. (=DFill) Hughes III" > wrote in message =
...
> Stephen Cowell wrote:
> >=20
> > But how do you "suck make it up"?

> If you had common sense you would have been able to plug in a
> couple of words in the below statement to make it make sense: "free
> loading bleeding heart liberals suck make it up
> with their false theories." If you really can't figure it out then I
> truly feel sorry for you. =20

But the point is... you type in gibberish!
__
Steve
..

"Nathan W. Collier" > wrote in message =
...
> "Stephen Cowell" > wrote in message=20
> .. .
>=20
> > Is a compound a mixture?
>=20
> youre still just a liar.

What? No smileys? No 'TRANSLATION'?

You're no fun anymore...
__
Steve
..

Well at least I have common sense and not stupid, like you.
God Bless America, ßill O|||||||O
http://www.billhughes.com/

Stephen Cowell wrote:
>
> But the point is... you type in gibberish!
> __
> Steve
> .