What's with E36 M3 asking prices?

What is it with the crazy prices some E36 M3 owners/dealers are trying to
get? This summer I toyed with getting one, but was turned off by the
attitudes of some of the owners I tried to deal wth. These guys (mostly
private parties) were trying to get upwards of $25,000 (some, a lot upwards)
for a 97 or 98 with 30 to 50 thousand miles, granted in nice condition. Well
above the numbers in Edmunds and KBB. This for cars that sold 6-7 years ago
for about $40,000 and that did not even have the "real" M3 engine that was
sold in Europe. I drove a '97 and it was nice, but nowhere near the "hot"
car I had expected. Not that much quicker than a 2001 E46 330i I drove and
that is a nicer car, overall.

Further, 2001 E46 M3 prices are falling to the mid-30's range now and that
car makes serious horsepower compared to the 240 of the US spec E36 M3.
Trying to get $30,000 for an E36 when for $5,000 more a buyer can get an E46
seems wildly optimisic. This in the mid-west, by the way.

People can ask whatever they want, of course, but it does give one to pause
why these guys are trying to get well over book for a car that is not all
that special. It's not a 911 for sure.

I know there are serious engine problems with the E46 M3 with lots of
recalls, but it seems that BMW is taking care of those problems. The E36 M3
was pretty reliable as long as you took care of that stupid plastic impeller
BMW put on the water pump. This a reliability thing holding E36 prices up?

- 303 sq

"303squadron" > wrote in message
...
> What is it with the crazy prices some E36 M3 owners/dealers are trying to
> get? This summer I toyed with getting one, but was turned off by the
> attitudes of some of the owners I tried to deal wth. These guys (mostly
> private parties) were trying to get upwards of $25,000 (some, a lot
upwards)
> for a 97 or 98 with 30 to 50 thousand miles, granted in nice condition.
Well
> above the numbers in Edmunds and KBB. This for cars that sold 6-7 years
ago
> for about $40,000 and that did not even have the "real" M3 engine that was
> sold in Europe. I drove a '97 and it was nice, but nowhere near the "hot"
> car I had expected. Not that much quicker than a 2001 E46 330i I drove and
> that is a nicer car, overall.
>
> Further, 2001 E46 M3 prices are falling to the mid-30's range now and that
> car makes serious horsepower compared to the 240 of the US spec E36 M3.
> Trying to get $30,000 for an E36 when for $5,000 more a buyer can get an
E46
> seems wildly optimisic. This in the mid-west, by the way.
>
> People can ask whatever they want, of course, but it does give one to
pause
> why these guys are trying to get well over book for a car that is not all
> that special. It's not a 911 for sure.
>
> I know there are serious engine problems with the E46 M3 with lots of
> recalls, but it seems that BMW is taking care of those problems. The E36
M3
> was pretty reliable as long as you took care of that stupid plastic
impeller
> BMW put on the water pump. This a reliability thing holding E36 prices up?
>
> - 303 sq

Woah! You guys got just 240 horses?! We (in the UK) had 286 bhp from
94-96/97, then 321 with the evoultion M3...

hehe, they didn't palm you off with an auto too, did they? <g>

Snoop

"303squadron" > wrote
> What is it with the crazy prices some E36 M3 owners/dealers are trying to
> get? This summer I toyed with getting one, but was turned off by the
> attitudes of some of the owners I tried to deal wth. These guys (mostly
> private parties) were trying to get upwards of $25,000 (some, a lot
> upwards)
> for a 97 or 98 with 30 to 50 thousand miles, granted in nice condition.
> Well
> above the numbers in Edmunds and KBB. This for cars that sold 6-7 years
> ago
> for about $40,000 and that did not even have the "real" M3 engine that was
> sold in Europe. I drove a '97 and it was nice, but nowhere near the "hot"
> car I had expected. Not that much quicker than a 2001 E46 330i I drove and
> that is a nicer car, overall.

I ran into the same thing last year when we bought Judy's Porsche Boxster.
Guy wanted to sell a '97 (1st model year) in the silver w/ red interior that
was the scheme Porsche used in all there adverts for around $40K, when
it was clearly not worth more than $30K (market prices for similar cars.)

Actually, there is a lot of this going around: people that are up-side down
in a lease or just believe that it's gotta be worth that, "as I only drove
it
on weekends, always garaged, never driven on gravel, etc." Got news
for all those guys: new cars cost very little, since the manufacturers
are desperate to sell their inventory, and this has driven used prices down.

A car is worth only what someone is willing to pay for it.

Floyd

In a previous posting, "Snoop" > had the
audacity to say:

:Woah! You guys got just 240 horses?! We (in the UK) had 286 bhp from
:94-96/97, then 321 with the evoultion M3...
:
:hehe, they didn't palm you off with an auto too, did they? <g>

That was certainly an option at the time (before SMG?), yeah.

--
E.R. aka SJG aka Ricardo
present location: vancouver bc canada
refugee from the european union's evil bureaucracy

"303squadron" > wrote in message
...
> What is it with the crazy prices some E36 M3 owners/dealers are trying to
> get? This summer I toyed with getting one, but was turned off by the
> attitudes of some of the owners I tried to deal wth. These guys (mostly
> private parties) were trying to get upwards of $25,000 (some, a lot
> upwards)
> for a 97 or 98 with 30 to 50 thousand miles, granted in nice condition.
> Well
> above the numbers in Edmunds and KBB. This for cars that sold 6-7 years
> ago
> for about $40,000 and that did not even have the "real" M3 engine that was
> sold in Europe. I drove a '97 and it was nice, but nowhere near the "hot"
> car I had expected. Not that much quicker than a 2001 E46 330i I drove and
> that is a nicer car, overall.
>
> Further, 2001 E46 M3 prices are falling to the mid-30's range now and that
> car makes serious horsepower compared to the 240 of the US spec E36 M3.
> Trying to get $30,000 for an E36 when for $5,000 more a buyer can get an
> E46
> seems wildly optimisic. This in the mid-west, by the way.
>
> People can ask whatever they want, of course, but it does give one to
> pause
> why these guys are trying to get well over book for a car that is not all
> that special. It's not a 911 for sure.
>
> I know there are serious engine problems with the E46 M3 with lots of
> recalls, but it seems that BMW is taking care of those problems. The E36
> M3
> was pretty reliable as long as you took care of that stupid plastic
> impeller
> BMW put on the water pump. This a reliability thing holding E36 prices up?

"asking price" is just that. You would have to look at the actual "sold at"
prices to determine the true values.

Also, kbb and edmunds do not handle "special interest" cars such as these
very well. I have no idea what they base their prices on but it does not
seem to be the actual sales prices. The price for the 97-98 M3's should be
right around $22k. Much more than that is wishful thinking...

You won't get what you don't ask for and it's always wise to leave room for
negotiating.

-Fred W

"fbloogyudsr" > wrote in message
...
>
> A car is worth only what someone is willing to pay for it.

Bingo! But it does work both ways, so if you could convince someone to pay
more... it's worth that much.

-Fred W

As an owner of a '98 M3, I thought I would chime in. My M3 is a 4 door, 5
speed, in estoril blue with grey interior. I live in the San Francisco Bay
area which does have high prices. But, there are plenty of E36 M3s around
for less than $25k. The E46 M3 is another matter, with some used ones at
$60k, and virtually nothing below $40,000. In my area, there is no way you
are going to find a $5000 gap between an E36 and E46 M3.

I have not found Edmunds, KBB, or any other site very good for M3s. Too
much of specialty car. I paid a good amount for my used '98 because it is a
4 door, which is not all that common, especially with a 5 speed.

The "real" M3 engine issue is not going to make any difference in the U.S.
The engine actually is quite torquey and suitable for U.S. driving. Of
course, you might really want that extra high end hp.

Interesting you mention the 330i. Before I bought the M3, I drove the 330i
and an E36 M3 back to back, at a dealer. The M3 was the hands down choice.
The engine is stronger, torquier, and with lower gearing, and less weight,
it is noticeably faster than the 330i. Not dramatically faster, but
definitely noticeable. But, the big difference is in over the road
behavior. The best way I can describe it is that the M3 is a somewhat
luxurious sports car, while the 330i is a sporty luxury car. The 330i rides
much better, but is not as sharp on handling. If the straightline
performance is really critical and you must have a BMW, then get a used E46
M3 or M5. The E46 M3 has plenty of hp, all on the top end, but still does
not have much torque advantage over the E36 M3 due to a modest increase in
torque, offset with more weight in the E46 cars.

It can be argued whether the car can be compared to a 911 or not, but most
certainly, the price of a 911 and the maintenance is well beyond what an E36
M3 would cost.

The plastic impeller was not on M3s beginning sometime in 96, and is
definitely not on any '97 or later car. A BMW waterpump can be had for $65
and if you are at all mechanically inclined, is easy to replace.

I am a bit puzzled. If the car is not all that special, why are you
interested in it?

- Phil


"303squadron" > wrote in message
...
> What is it with the crazy prices some E36 M3 owners/dealers are trying to
> get? This summer I toyed with getting one, but was turned off by the
> attitudes of some of the owners I tried to deal wth. These guys (mostly
> private parties) were trying to get upwards of $25,000 (some, a lot
> upwards)
> for a 97 or 98 with 30 to 50 thousand miles, granted in nice condition.
> Well
> above the numbers in Edmunds and KBB. This for cars that sold 6-7 years
> ago
> for about $40,000 and that did not even have the "real" M3 engine that was
> sold in Europe. I drove a '97 and it was nice, but nowhere near the "hot"
> car I had expected. Not that much quicker than a 2001 E46 330i I drove and
> that is a nicer car, overall.
>
> Further, 2001 E46 M3 prices are falling to the mid-30's range now and that
> car makes serious horsepower compared to the 240 of the US spec E36 M3.
> Trying to get $30,000 for an E36 when for $5,000 more a buyer can get an
> E46
> seems wildly optimisic. This in the mid-west, by the way.
>
> People can ask whatever they want, of course, but it does give one to
> pause
> why these guys are trying to get well over book for a car that is not all
> that special. It's not a 911 for sure.
>
> I know there are serious engine problems with the E46 M3 with lots of
> recalls, but it seems that BMW is taking care of those problems. The E36
> M3
> was pretty reliable as long as you took care of that stupid plastic
> impeller
> BMW put on the water pump. This a reliability thing holding E36 prices up?
>
> - 303 sq
>
>
>

I currently own an E36 M3...a '99 5 speed, 2 dr coupe in Cosmos Black
with black interior.

Because I just purchased an M5...a '00 jet black with caramel/black
interior, I decided to sell the M3.

I too live in an area that has a lot of M3s around town (Washington
DC/Montgomery County Maryland) and my original asking price of $20,000
was apparently too high since I got no serious inquiries.

I now have it at $17,500 OBO...still nothing.

The car has been religiously serviced.....and I'm a schmuck that pays
retail...having had the Service 2 completed a 2nd time at a BMW
dealership.

The car does have 106,000 miles on it, but it looks and runs
perfectly. I have never abused or red-lined it.

I see low mileage e36 M3s in the Washington Post for $20K, and
convertibles for $26K....you'd think $17,500 for mine would be a steal
for somebody out there.

It's a mystery to me why I haven't gotten a serious party interested
in it as of yet.

David H.


"Phil" > wrote in message news:<Il68d.172867$D%.47901@attbi_s51>...
> As an owner of a '98 M3, I thought I would chime in. My M3 is a 4 door, 5
> speed, in estoril blue with grey interior. I live in the San Francisco Bay
> area which does have high prices. But, there are plenty of E36 M3s around
> for less than $25k. The E46 M3 is another matter, with some used ones at
> $60k, and virtually nothing below $40,000. In my area, there is no way you
> are going to find a $5000 gap between an E36 and E46 M3.
>
> I have not found Edmunds, KBB, or any other site very good for M3s. Too
> much of specialty car. I paid a good amount for my used '98 because it is a
> 4 door, which is not all that common, especially with a 5 speed.
>
> The "real" M3 engine issue is not going to make any difference in the U.S.
> The engine actually is quite torquey and suitable for U.S. driving. Of
> course, you might really want that extra high end hp.
>
> Interesting you mention the 330i. Before I bought the M3, I drove the 330i
> and an E36 M3 back to back, at a dealer. The M3 was the hands down choice.
> The engine is stronger, torquier, and with lower gearing, and less weight,
> it is noticeably faster than the 330i. Not dramatically faster, but
> definitely noticeable. But, the big difference is in over the road
> behavior. The best way I can describe it is that the M3 is a somewhat
> luxurious sports car, while the 330i is a sporty luxury car. The 330i rides
> much better, but is not as sharp on handling. If the straightline
> performance is really critical and you must have a BMW, then get a used E46
> M3 or M5. The E46 M3 has plenty of hp, all on the top end, but still does
> not have much torque advantage over the E36 M3 due to a modest increase in
> torque, offset with more weight in the E46 cars.
>
> It can be argued whether the car can be compared to a 911 or not, but most
> certainly, the price of a 911 and the maintenance is well beyond what an E36
> M3 would cost.
>
> The plastic impeller was not on M3s beginning sometime in 96, and is
> definitely not on any '97 or later car. A BMW waterpump can be had for $65
> and if you are at all mechanically inclined, is easy to replace.
>
> I am a bit puzzled. If the car is not all that special, why are you
> interested in it?
>
> - Phil
>

On 4 Oct 2004 06:37:05 -0700, (David Haqeman) wrote:

>I currently own an E36 M3...a '99 5 speed, 2 dr coupe in Cosmos Black
>with black interior.
>
>Because I just purchased an M5...a '00 jet black with caramel/black
>interior, I decided to sell the M3.
>
>I too live in an area that has a lot of M3s around town (Washington
>DC/Montgomery County Maryland) and my original asking price of $20,000
>was apparently too high since I got no serious inquiries.
>
>I now have it at $17,500 OBO...still nothing.
>
>The car has been religiously serviced.....and I'm a schmuck that pays
>retail...having had the Service 2 completed a 2nd time at a BMW
>dealership.
>
>The car does have 106,000 miles on it, but it looks and runs
>perfectly. I have never abused or red-lined it.
>
>I see low mileage e36 M3s in the Washington Post for $20K, and
>convertibles for $26K....you'd think $17,500 for mine would be a steal
>for somebody out there.
>
>It's a mystery to me why I haven't gotten a serious party interested
>in it as of yet.

6 digits of mileage on an M3 should leave little doubt:

paranoia strikes deep...

"...6 digits of mileage on an M3 should leave little doubt:.."

"...paranoia strikes deep...".

Unfortunately, yes it does. I may just give my M3 to my daughter as a
graduation gift, and then get a used M5. BMWs can go high miles without
much trouble.

- Phil