Electric cars head toward another dead end

On Feb 10, 11:16*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
> On Feb 10, 6:16*am, "Existential Angst" > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > "I do wonder about the Tesla tho. *That car seems to have broken thru
> > some mileage barriers, but it's tough to separate hype from price from
> > reality. "
>
> >http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/10/au...n-the-ev-highw...
>
> > "But as I discovered on a recent test drive of the company’s high-
> > performance Model S sedan, theory can be trumped by reality,
> > especially when Northeast temperatures plunge."
>
> > "At the Washington Auto Show last month, Dr. Chu, who has since
> > announced his plan to leave office in the next few weeks, discussed
> > the Energy Department’s goal of making electric vehicles and plug-in
> > hybrids as cheap and convenient as comparable gasoline-powered cars.
>
> > He continued: “We can’t say this everywhere in America yet, but
> > driving by a gasoline station and smiling is something everyone should
> > experience.”
>
> > I drove a state-of-the-art electric vehicle past a lot of gas
> > stations. I wasn’t smiling.
>
> > Instead, I spent nearly an hour at the Milford service plaza as the
> > Tesla sucked electrons from the hitching post. When I continued my
> > drive, the display read 185 miles, well beyond the distance I intended
> > to cover before returning to the station the next morning for a
> > recharge and returning to Manhattan.
>
> > I drove, slowly, to Stonington, Conn., for dinner and spent the night
> > in Groton, a total distance of 79 miles. When I parked the car, its
> > computer said I had 90 miles of range, twice the 46 miles back to
> > Milford. It was a different story at 8:30 the next morning. The
> > thermometer read 10 degrees and the display showed 25 miles of
> > remaining range — the electrical equivalent of someone having siphoned
> > off more than two-thirds of the fuel that was in the tank when I
> > parked.
>
> > *I called Tesla in California, and the official I woke up said I
> > needed to “condition” the battery pack to restore the lost energy.
> > That meant sitting in the car for half an hour with the heat on a low
> > setting. (There is now a mobile application for warming the battery
> > remotely; it was not available at the time of my test drive.)
>
> > After completing the battery conditioning process, the estimated range
> > reading was 19 miles; no way would I make it back to Milford.
>
> > The Tesla people found an E.V. charging facility that Norwich Public
> > Utilities had recently installed. Norwich, an old mill town on the
> > Thames River, was only 11 miles away, though in the opposite direction
> > from Milford.
>
> > After making arrangements to recharge at the Norwich station, I
> > located the proper adapter in the trunk, plugged in and walked to the
> > only warm place nearby, Butch’s Luncheonette and Breakfast Club, an
> > establishment (smoking allowed) where only members can buy a cup of
> > coffee or a plate of eggs. But the owners let me wait there while the
> > Model S drank its juice. Tesla’s experts said that pumping in a little
> > energy would help restore the power lost overnight as a result of the
> > cold weather, and after an hour they cleared me to resume the trip to
> > Milford.
>
> > Looking back, I should have bought a membership to Butch’s and spent a
> > few hours there while the car charged. The displayed range never
> > reached the number of miles remaining to Milford, and as I limped
> > along at about 45 miles per hour I saw increasingly dire dashboard
> > warnings to recharge immediately. Mr. Merendino, the product planner,
> > found an E.V. charging station about five miles away.
>
> > But the Model S had other ideas. “Car is shutting down,” the computer
> > informed me. I was able to coast down an exit ramp in Branford, Conn.,
> > before the car made good on its threat.
>
> > Tesla’s New York service manager, Adam Williams, found a towing
> > service in Milford that sent a skilled and very patient driver, Rick
> > Ibsen, to rescue me with a flatbed truck. Not so quick: the car’s
> > electrically actuated parking brake would not release without battery
> > power, and hooking the car’s 12-volt charging post behind the front
> > grille to the tow truck’s portable charger would not release the
> > brake. So he had to drag it onto the flatbed, a painstaking process
> > that took 45 minutes. Fortunately, the cab of the tow truck was
> > toasty.
>
> > At 2:40 p.m., we pulled into the Milford rest stop, five hours after I
> > had left Groton on a trip that should have taken less than an hour.
> > Mr. Ibsen carefully maneuvered the flatbed close to the charging
> > kiosk, and 25 minutes later, with the battery sufficiently charged to
> > release the parking brake and drive off the truck, the car was back on
> > the ground. A Model S owner who had taken delivery the previous day
> > watched with interest."
> > ================================================== =============
>
> > My reading comprehension is a little low..... *So what did the Tesla finally
> > wind up with, as a range?
>
> > I'm gathering about 100 miles?? *Which is about what the Leaf claims. *But
> > indeed, temp. dependent.
>
> > Tesla was claiming 240, 300 miles. *Downhill with a tailwind?? *lol
>
> > They have an 85 kW-hr battery. *15 hp (for about 60 mph) is about 10 kW,
> > which should last 8.5 hrs.
> > 8.5 hrs x 60 mph is pert near a 500 mi range.... * ???
>
> > I also read that Tesla will not let reviewers actually take the car home,
> > they can only test under supervision -- which apparently changed in this
> > NYTimes article -- and if the range is only 100 mi, now we know why.
>
> > The Tesla makes the Volt look like a bargain. *I wonder what Tesla's
> > batteries cost, and how long they last. *Dat super-fast charging doesn't
> > help batt life, either.
> > --
> > EA
>
> I'm left with the feeling that Tesla Motors didn't do anywhere near
> enough testing of the Model S in the cold.

Tesla Motors Chairman, Product Architect & CEO Elon Musk says they
have done plenty of testing in the cold for the Model S and that they
got screwed by the New York Times:

http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/most...iar-test-drive

On Feb 14, 11:20*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
> On Feb 10, 11:16*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 10, 6:16*am, "Existential Angst" > wrote:
>
> > > "I do wonder about the Tesla tho. *That car seems to have broken thru
> > > some mileage barriers, but it's tough to separate hype from price from
> > > reality. "
>
> > >http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/10/au...n-the-ev-highw....
>
> > > "But as I discovered on a recent test drive of the company’s high-
> > > performance Model S sedan, theory can be trumped by reality,
> > > especially when Northeast temperatures plunge."
>
> > > "At the Washington Auto Show last month, Dr. Chu, who has since
> > > announced his plan to leave office in the next few weeks, discussed
> > > the Energy Department’s goal of making electric vehicles and plug-in
> > > hybrids as cheap and convenient as comparable gasoline-powered cars.
>
> > > He continued: “We can’t say this everywhere in America yet, but
> > > driving by a gasoline station and smiling is something everyone should
> > > experience.”
>
> > > I drove a state-of-the-art electric vehicle past a lot of gas
> > > stations. I wasn’t smiling.
>
> > > Instead, I spent nearly an hour at the Milford service plaza as the
> > > Tesla sucked electrons from the hitching post. When I continued my
> > > drive, the display read 185 miles, well beyond the distance I intended
> > > to cover before returning to the station the next morning for a
> > > recharge and returning to Manhattan.
>
> > > I drove, slowly, to Stonington, Conn., for dinner and spent the night
> > > in Groton, a total distance of 79 miles. When I parked the car, its
> > > computer said I had 90 miles of range, twice the 46 miles back to
> > > Milford. It was a different story at 8:30 the next morning. The
> > > thermometer read 10 degrees and the display showed 25 miles of
> > > remaining range — the electrical equivalent of someone having siphoned
> > > off more than two-thirds of the fuel that was in the tank when I
> > > parked.
>
> > > *I called Tesla in California, and the official I woke up said I
> > > needed to “condition” the battery pack to restore the lost energy..
> > > That meant sitting in the car for half an hour with the heat on a low
> > > setting. (There is now a mobile application for warming the battery
> > > remotely; it was not available at the time of my test drive.)
>
> > > After completing the battery conditioning process, the estimated range
> > > reading was 19 miles; no way would I make it back to Milford.
>
> > > The Tesla people found an E.V. charging facility that Norwich Public
> > > Utilities had recently installed. Norwich, an old mill town on the
> > > Thames River, was only 11 miles away, though in the opposite direction
> > > from Milford.
>
> > > After making arrangements to recharge at the Norwich station, I
> > > located the proper adapter in the trunk, plugged in and walked to the
> > > only warm place nearby, Butch’s Luncheonette and Breakfast Club, an
> > > establishment (smoking allowed) where only members can buy a cup of
> > > coffee or a plate of eggs. But the owners let me wait there while the
> > > Model S drank its juice. Tesla’s experts said that pumping in a little
> > > energy would help restore the power lost overnight as a result of the
> > > cold weather, and after an hour they cleared me to resume the trip to
> > > Milford.
>
> > > Looking back, I should have bought a membership to Butch’s and spent a
> > > few hours there while the car charged. The displayed range never
> > > reached the number of miles remaining to Milford, and as I limped
> > > along at about 45 miles per hour I saw increasingly dire dashboard
> > > warnings to recharge immediately. Mr. Merendino, the product planner,
> > > found an E.V. charging station about five miles away.
>
> > > But the Model S had other ideas. “Car is shutting down,” the computer
> > > informed me. I was able to coast down an exit ramp in Branford, Conn.,
> > > before the car made good on its threat.
>
> > > Tesla’s New York service manager, Adam Williams, found a towing
> > > service in Milford that sent a skilled and very patient driver, Rick
> > > Ibsen, to rescue me with a flatbed truck. Not so quick: the car’s
> > > electrically actuated parking brake would not release without battery
> > > power, and hooking the car’s 12-volt charging post behind the front
> > > grille to the tow truck’s portable charger would not release the
> > > brake. So he had to drag it onto the flatbed, a painstaking process
> > > that took 45 minutes. Fortunately, the cab of the tow truck was
> > > toasty.
>
> > > At 2:40 p.m., we pulled into the Milford rest stop, five hours after I
> > > had left Groton on a trip that should have taken less than an hour.
> > > Mr. Ibsen carefully maneuvered the flatbed close to the charging
> > > kiosk, and 25 minutes later, with the battery sufficiently charged to
> > > release the parking brake and drive off the truck, the car was back on
> > > the ground. A Model S owner who had taken delivery the previous day
> > > watched with interest."
> > > ================================================== =============
>
> > > My reading comprehension is a little low..... *So what did the Tesla finally
> > > wind up with, as a range?
>
> > > I'm gathering about 100 miles?? *Which is about what the Leaf claims. *But
> > > indeed, temp. dependent.
>
> > > Tesla was claiming 240, 300 miles. *Downhill with a tailwind?? *lol
>
> > > They have an 85 kW-hr battery. *15 hp (for about 60 mph) is about 10 kW,
> > > which should last 8.5 hrs.
> > > 8.5 hrs x 60 mph is pert near a 500 mi range.... * ???
>
> > > I also read that Tesla will not let reviewers actually take the car home,
> > > they can only test under supervision -- which apparently changed in this
> > > NYTimes article -- and if the range is only 100 mi, now we know why.
>
> > > The Tesla makes the Volt look like a bargain. *I wonder what Tesla's
> > > batteries cost, and how long they last. *Dat super-fast charging doesn't
> > > help batt life, either.
> > > --
> > > EA
>
> > I'm left with the feeling that Tesla Motors didn't do anywhere near
> > enough testing of the Model S in the cold.
>
> Tesla Motors Chairman, Product Architect & CEO *Elon Musk says they
> have done plenty of testing in the cold for the Model S and that they
> got screwed by the New York Times:
>
> http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/most...iar-test-drive

Mo

http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoram...155525527.html

On Thursday, February 14, 2013 6:55:30 PM UTC-6, jon_banquer wrote:
> On Feb 14, 11:20*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
>
> > On Feb 10, 11:16*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > > On Feb 10, 6:16*am, "Existential Angst" > wrote:
>
> >
>
> > > > "I do wonder about the Tesla tho. *That car seems to have broken thru
>
> > > > some mileage barriers, but it's tough to separate hype from price from
>
> > > > reality. "
>
> >
>
> > > >http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/10/au...n-the-ev-highw...
>
> >
>
> > > > "But as I discovered on a recent test drive of the company’s high-
>
> > > > performance Model S sedan, theory can be trumped by reality,
>
> > > > especially when Northeast temperatures plunge."
>
> >
>
> > > > "At the Washington Auto Show last month, Dr. Chu, who has since
>
> > > > announced his plan to leave office in the next few weeks, discussed
>
> > > > the Energy Department’s goal of making electric vehicles and plug-in
>
> > > > hybrids as cheap and convenient as comparable gasoline-powered cars..
>
> >
>
> > > > He continued: “We can’t say this everywhere in America yet, but
>
> > > > driving by a gasoline station and smiling is something everyone should
>
> > > > experience.”
>
> >
>
> > > > I drove a state-of-the-art electric vehicle past a lot of gas
>
> > > > stations. I wasn’t smiling.
>
> >
>
> > > > Instead, I spent nearly an hour at the Milford service plaza as the
>
> > > > Tesla sucked electrons from the hitching post. When I continued my
>
> > > > drive, the display read 185 miles, well beyond the distance I intended
>
> > > > to cover before returning to the station the next morning for a
>
> > > > recharge and returning to Manhattan.
>
> >
>
> > > > I drove, slowly, to Stonington, Conn., for dinner and spent the night
>
> > > > in Groton, a total distance of 79 miles. When I parked the car, its
>
> > > > computer said I had 90 miles of range, twice the 46 miles back to
>
> > > > Milford. It was a different story at 8:30 the next morning. The
>
> > > > thermometer read 10 degrees and the display showed 25 miles of
>
> > > > remaining range — the electrical equivalent of someone having siphoned
>
> > > > off more than two-thirds of the fuel that was in the tank when I
>
> > > > parked.
>
> >
>
> > > > *I called Tesla in California, and the official I woke up said I
>
> > > > needed to “condition” the battery pack to restore the lost energy.
>
> > > > That meant sitting in the car for half an hour with the heat on a low
>
> > > > setting. (There is now a mobile application for warming the battery
>
> > > > remotely; it was not available at the time of my test drive.)
>
> >
>
> > > > After completing the battery conditioning process, the estimated range
>
> > > > reading was 19 miles; no way would I make it back to Milford.
>
> >
>
> > > > The Tesla people found an E.V. charging facility that Norwich Public
>
> > > > Utilities had recently installed. Norwich, an old mill town on the
>
> > > > Thames River, was only 11 miles away, though in the opposite direction
>
> > > > from Milford.
>
> >
>
> > > > After making arrangements to recharge at the Norwich station, I
>
> > > > located the proper adapter in the trunk, plugged in and walked to the
>
> > > > only warm place nearby, Butch’s Luncheonette and Breakfast Club, an
>
> > > > establishment (smoking allowed) where only members can buy a cup of
>
> > > > coffee or a plate of eggs. But the owners let me wait there while the
>
> > > > Model S drank its juice. Tesla’s experts said that pumping in a little
>
> > > > energy would help restore the power lost overnight as a result of the
>
> > > > cold weather, and after an hour they cleared me to resume the trip to
>
> > > > Milford.
>
> >
>
> > > > Looking back, I should have bought a membership to Butch’s and spent a
>
> > > > few hours there while the car charged. The displayed range never
>
> > > > reached the number of miles remaining to Milford, and as I limped
>
> > > > along at about 45 miles per hour I saw increasingly dire dashboard
>
> > > > warnings to recharge immediately. Mr. Merendino, the product planner,
>
> > > > found an E.V. charging station about five miles away.
>
> >
>
> > > > But the Model S had other ideas. “Car is shutting down,” the computer
>
> > > > informed me. I was able to coast down an exit ramp in Branford, Conn.,
>
> > > > before the car made good on its threat.
>
> >
>
> > > > Tesla’s New York service manager, Adam Williams, found a towing
>
> > > > service in Milford that sent a skilled and very patient driver, Rick
>
> > > > Ibsen, to rescue me with a flatbed truck. Not so quick: the car’s
>
> > > > electrically actuated parking brake would not release without battery
>
> > > > power, and hooking the car’s 12-volt charging post behind the front
>
> > > > grille to the tow truck’s portable charger would not release the
>
> > > > brake. So he had to drag it onto the flatbed, a painstaking process
>
> > > > that took 45 minutes. Fortunately, the cab of the tow truck was
>
> > > > toasty.
>
> >
>
> > > > At 2:40 p.m., we pulled into the Milford rest stop, five hours after I
>
> > > > had left Groton on a trip that should have taken less than an hour.
>
> > > > Mr. Ibsen carefully maneuvered the flatbed close to the charging
>
> > > > kiosk, and 25 minutes later, with the battery sufficiently charged to
>
> > > > release the parking brake and drive off the truck, the car was back on
>
> > > > the ground. A Model S owner who had taken delivery the previous day
>
> > > > watched with interest."
>
> > > > ================================================== =============
>
> >
>
> > > > My reading comprehension is a little low..... *So what did the Tesla finally
>
> > > > wind up with, as a range?
>
> >
>
> > > > I'm gathering about 100 miles?? *Which is about what the Leaf claims. *But
>
> > > > indeed, temp. dependent.
>
> >
>
> > > > Tesla was claiming 240, 300 miles. *Downhill with a tailwind?? *lol
>
> >
>
> > > > They have an 85 kW-hr battery. *15 hp (for about 60 mph) is about 10 kW,
>
> > > > which should last 8.5 hrs.
>
> > > > 8.5 hrs x 60 mph is pert near a 500 mi range.... * ???
>
> >
>
> > > > I also read that Tesla will not let reviewers actually take the car home,
>
> > > > they can only test under supervision -- which apparently changed in this
>
> > > > NYTimes article -- and if the range is only 100 mi, now we know why..
>
> >
>
> > > > The Tesla makes the Volt look like a bargain. *I wonder what Tesla's
>
> > > > batteries cost, and how long they last. *Dat super-fast charging doesn't
>
> > > > help batt life, either.
>
> > > > --
>
> > > > EA
>
> >
>
> > > I'm left with the feeling that Tesla Motors didn't do anywhere near
>
> > > enough testing of the Model S in the cold.
>
> >
>
> > Tesla Motors Chairman, Product Architect & CEO *Elon Musk says they
>
> > have done plenty of testing in the cold for the Model S and that they
>
> > got screwed by the New York Times:
>
> >
>
> > http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/most...iar-test-drive
>
>
>
> Mo
>
>
>
> http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoram...155525527.html

Google,,, 1898 Munson Electric Gasoline Hybrid

On Feb 14, 4:55*pm, jon_banquer > wrote:
> On Feb 14, 11:20*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Feb 10, 11:16*am, jon_banquer > wrote:
>
> > > On Feb 10, 6:16*am, "Existential Angst" > wrote:
>
> > > > "I do wonder about the Tesla tho. *That car seems to have broken thru
> > > > some mileage barriers, but it's tough to separate hype from price from
> > > > reality. "
>
> > > >http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/10/au...n-the-ev-highw...
>
> > > > "But as I discovered on a recent test drive of the company’s high-
> > > > performance Model S sedan, theory can be trumped by reality,
> > > > especially when Northeast temperatures plunge."
>
> > > > "At the Washington Auto Show last month, Dr. Chu, who has since
> > > > announced his plan to leave office in the next few weeks, discussed
> > > > the Energy Department’s goal of making electric vehicles and plug-in
> > > > hybrids as cheap and convenient as comparable gasoline-powered cars..
>
> > > > He continued: “We can’t say this everywhere in America yet, but
> > > > driving by a gasoline station and smiling is something everyone should
> > > > experience.”
>
> > > > I drove a state-of-the-art electric vehicle past a lot of gas
> > > > stations. I wasn’t smiling.
>
> > > > Instead, I spent nearly an hour at the Milford service plaza as the
> > > > Tesla sucked electrons from the hitching post. When I continued my
> > > > drive, the display read 185 miles, well beyond the distance I intended
> > > > to cover before returning to the station the next morning for a
> > > > recharge and returning to Manhattan.
>
> > > > I drove, slowly, to Stonington, Conn., for dinner and spent the night
> > > > in Groton, a total distance of 79 miles. When I parked the car, its
> > > > computer said I had 90 miles of range, twice the 46 miles back to
> > > > Milford. It was a different story at 8:30 the next morning. The
> > > > thermometer read 10 degrees and the display showed 25 miles of
> > > > remaining range — the electrical equivalent of someone having siphoned
> > > > off more than two-thirds of the fuel that was in the tank when I
> > > > parked.
>
> > > > *I called Tesla in California, and the official I woke up said I
> > > > needed to “condition” the battery pack to restore the lost energy.
> > > > That meant sitting in the car for half an hour with the heat on a low
> > > > setting. (There is now a mobile application for warming the battery
> > > > remotely; it was not available at the time of my test drive.)
>
> > > > After completing the battery conditioning process, the estimated range
> > > > reading was 19 miles; no way would I make it back to Milford.
>
> > > > The Tesla people found an E.V. charging facility that Norwich Public
> > > > Utilities had recently installed. Norwich, an old mill town on the
> > > > Thames River, was only 11 miles away, though in the opposite direction
> > > > from Milford.
>
> > > > After making arrangements to recharge at the Norwich station, I
> > > > located the proper adapter in the trunk, plugged in and walked to the
> > > > only warm place nearby, Butch’s Luncheonette and Breakfast Club, an
> > > > establishment (smoking allowed) where only members can buy a cup of
> > > > coffee or a plate of eggs. But the owners let me wait there while the
> > > > Model S drank its juice. Tesla’s experts said that pumping in a little
> > > > energy would help restore the power lost overnight as a result of the
> > > > cold weather, and after an hour they cleared me to resume the trip to
> > > > Milford.
>
> > > > Looking back, I should have bought a membership to Butch’s and spent a
> > > > few hours there while the car charged. The displayed range never
> > > > reached the number of miles remaining to Milford, and as I limped
> > > > along at about 45 miles per hour I saw increasingly dire dashboard
> > > > warnings to recharge immediately. Mr. Merendino, the product planner,
> > > > found an E.V. charging station about five miles away.
>
> > > > But the Model S had other ideas. “Car is shutting down,” the computer
> > > > informed me. I was able to coast down an exit ramp in Branford, Conn.,
> > > > before the car made good on its threat.
>
> > > > Tesla’s New York service manager, Adam Williams, found a towing
> > > > service in Milford that sent a skilled and very patient driver, Rick
> > > > Ibsen, to rescue me with a flatbed truck. Not so quick: the car’s
> > > > electrically actuated parking brake would not release without battery
> > > > power, and hooking the car’s 12-volt charging post behind the front
> > > > grille to the tow truck’s portable charger would not release the
> > > > brake. So he had to drag it onto the flatbed, a painstaking process
> > > > that took 45 minutes. Fortunately, the cab of the tow truck was
> > > > toasty.
>
> > > > At 2:40 p.m., we pulled into the Milford rest stop, five hours after I
> > > > had left Groton on a trip that should have taken less than an hour.
> > > > Mr. Ibsen carefully maneuvered the flatbed close to the charging
> > > > kiosk, and 25 minutes later, with the battery sufficiently charged to
> > > > release the parking brake and drive off the truck, the car was back on
> > > > the ground. A Model S owner who had taken delivery the previous day
> > > > watched with interest."
> > > > ================================================== =============
>
> > > > My reading comprehension is a little low..... *So what did the Tesla finally
> > > > wind up with, as a range?
>
> > > > I'm gathering about 100 miles?? *Which is about what the Leaf claims. *But
> > > > indeed, temp. dependent.
>
> > > > Tesla was claiming 240, 300 miles. *Downhill with a tailwind?? *lol
>
> > > > They have an 85 kW-hr battery. *15 hp (for about 60 mph) is about 10 kW,
> > > > which should last 8.5 hrs.
> > > > 8.5 hrs x 60 mph is pert near a 500 mi range.... * ???
>
> > > > I also read that Tesla will not let reviewers actually take the car home,
> > > > they can only test under supervision -- which apparently changed in this
> > > > NYTimes article -- and if the range is only 100 mi, now we know why..
>
> > > > The Tesla makes the Volt look like a bargain. *I wonder what Tesla's
> > > > batteries cost, and how long they last. *Dat super-fast charging doesn't
> > > > help batt life, either.
> > > > --
> > > > EA
>
> > > I'm left with the feeling that Tesla Motors didn't do anywhere near
> > > enough testing of the Model S in the cold.
>
> > Tesla Motors Chairman, Product Architect & CEO *Elon Musk says they
> > have done plenty of testing in the cold for the Model S and that they
> > got screwed by the New York Times:
>
> >http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/most...iar-test-drive
>
> Mo
>
> http://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoram...es-story-secre...

Mo

http://www.anandtech.com/show/6759/t...ency-and-range

"jon_banquer" > wrote in message
news:eea6faac-a5c8-46e5-a019-
>http://www.anandtech.com/show/6759/t...ency-and-range

http://www.hbingham.com/humor/new-england-weather.htm
"40 F: Italian and English cars won't start."

I do drive with the windows open at 40F.