.sig change

Zathras wrote:
<snip>
>>Then the bike
>>
>>And not won spelling miss take, just don't start on the gran'ma
>
> Ah ha..it all makes more sense and surely suggests a need for
> therapy?!

Huh? That *is* the therapy....

> Anyway, isn't a 155 a bit up to date for you - I mean you
> might even be thinking of a 156 next...now they're *out of print* so
> to speak! ;-)

Funny you should say that. Thing is I it for my business. Much as I love
the old ones, I'm not gonna run a Spritn of a V6 Giulietta as a daily hack.
75 was OK, but it was always on the books to change for something with a
bit more 'wow' factor, for the benefit of clients.

--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 75 2.0 TS (Badly bent) 155 TS
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 08:46:56 GMT, Catman
> wrote:

>Zathras wrote:
<snip>
>> Anyway, isn't a 155 a bit up to date for you - I mean you
>> might even be thinking of a 156 next...now they're *out of print* so
>> to speak! ;-)
>
>Funny you should say that. Thing is I it for my business. Much as I love
>the old ones, I'm not gonna run a Spritn of a V6 Giulietta as a daily hack.
>75 was OK, but it was always on the books to change for something with a
>bit more 'wow' factor, for the benefit of clients.

Ooooh! You mean a 1.9JTD GT then? That would fit the bill nicely. Or
you could even wait for the 200hp 2.4 JTD 159 and then you could bin
the V6 too! (ducks!)

Failing that, mine (the model not *mine* as I'm keeping that) is a
fine all-round performance car. 42mpg 4 year average for a car that
*never* goes slowly or spends much time on motorways, bullet-proof
engine (oil checks? - don't bother..sort of thing), effortless to
drive quickly (lots of overtaking on A roads don't even need a change
down from 5th) due to the torque. The engine does sound good - sort of
like a V8 (really) when booted - and the car is genuinely quicker on
the road than it's official 0-60 suggests. I did tests a while back
and found that a diesel like this, once it's rolling, is comparable to
petrol cars about 1s quicker to 60. I compared mine to a 2.0JTS back
to back and..er..sorry..but the torque on the 2.4 made the 2.0 feel
totally outclassed until there was enough road space to scream the
2.0. Even then there wasn't much in it except for the 2.0 being able
to rev for what seemed like forever in comparison. It still gets
admiring comments so it's still got just a little *wow* left.

Most importantly, they're looking like bargains second-hand! The only
fly in the ointment is it's not very safe if you're planning on going
*off road* any more!!! ;-) (hiding now!) (pokes head up to say)
they do have outside temperature gauges though (runs away scared this
time)...

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)

Zathras wrote:


> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 08:46:56 GMT, Catman
> > wrote:
>
>>Zathras wrote:
> <snip>
>>> Anyway, isn't a 155 a bit up to date for you - I mean you
>>> might even be thinking of a 156 next...now they're *out of print* so
>>> to speak! ;-)
>>
>>Funny you should say that. Thing is I it for my business. Much as I love
>>the old ones, I'm not gonna run a Spritn of a V6 Giulietta as a daily
>>hack. 75 was OK, but it was always on the books to change for something
>>with a bit more 'wow' factor, for the benefit of clients.
>
> Ooooh! You mean a 1.9JTD GT then? That would fit the bill nicely.

Bill, but not budget
> Or
> you could even wait for the 200hp 2.4 JTD 159 and then you could bin
> the V6 too! (ducks!)

Good move

> Failing that, mine (the model not *mine* as I'm keeping that) is a
> fine all-round performance car. 42mpg 4 year average for a car that
> *never* goes slowly or spends much time on motorways, bullet-proof
> engine (oil checks? - don't bother..sort of thing), effortless to
> drive quickly (lots of overtaking on A roads don't even need a change
> down from 5th) due to the torque. The engine does sound good - sort of
> like a V8 (really) when booted - and the car is genuinely quicker on
> the road than it's official 0-60 suggests. I did tests a while back
> and found that a diesel like this, once it's rolling, is comparable to
> petrol cars about 1s quicker to 60. I compared mine to a 2.0JTS back
> to back and..er..sorry..but the torque on the 2.4 made the 2.0 feel
> totally outclassed until there was enough road space to scream the
> 2.0. Even then there wasn't much in it except for the 2.0 being able
> to rev for what seemed like forever in comparison. It still gets
> admiring comments so it's still got just a little *wow* left.
>
> Most importantly, they're looking like bargains second-hand! The only
> fly in the ointment is it's not very safe if you're planning on going
> *off road* any more!!! ;-) (hiding now!) (pokes head up to say)
> they do have outside temperature gauges though (runs away scared this
> time)...
>
I have been *ordered* to test drive one. By people that have been making a
living from profssional alfalising since before I was born, Literally.
Still out of my budget atm though. Maybe next year though.

And as for the temp gauge, well wtf. Pilot error can happen to anyone. We
wlaked away. It's a lessons that I am fortunate to have learned.

--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 75 2.0 TS (Badly bent) 155 TS
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 21:56:54 GMT, Catman
> wrote:

<snip>
> Maybe next year though.

...and I had you down as an old fashioned Alfisti petrol-head too!!

>And as for the temp gauge, well wtf. Pilot error can happen to anyone. We
>wlaked away. It's a lessons that I am fortunate to have learned.

Absolutely! (I *was* trying to be more funny than critical - I know
it's all too easy to lose concentration at that crucial moment even
for an otherwise impeccable driver. Everybody makes mistakes).

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)

Zathras wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 21:56:54 GMT, Catman
> > wrote:
>
> <snip>
>> Maybe next year though.
>
> ..and I had you down as an old fashioned Alfisti petrol-head too!!

OK. It will be a tough call which comes first. SZ or 156.....

>>And as for the temp gauge, well wtf. Pilot error can happen to anyone.
>>We
>>wlaked away. It's a lessons that I am fortunate to have learned.
>
> Absolutely! (I *was* trying to be more funny than critical - I know
> it's all too easy to lose concentration at that crucial moment even
> for an otherwise impeccable driver. Everybody makes mistakes).

Hands up here. I don't think any more concentration would have helped me.
My honest opinion is that I was just not a good enough driver to handle
that.
I tend to be my own harshest critic [1]

Interesting bit in the Torygraph today about skid pan training though.
Anyone up for booking a session?

[1] As well as being my own greatest plaudit
--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 75 2.0 TS (Badly bent) 155 TS
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:49:54 GMT, Catman
> wrote:

<snip>
> Interesting bit in the Torygraph today about skid pan training though.
>Anyone up for booking a session?

Trouble is that skid pans are often bigger than roads with no
on-coming traffic and you can spot them a mile off!! It's a good laugh
though.

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)

Zathras wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:49:54 GMT, Catman
> > wrote:
>
> <snip>
>> Interesting bit in the Torygraph today about skid pan training though.
>>Anyone up for booking a session?
>
> Trouble is that skid pans are often bigger than roads with no
> on-coming traffic and you can spot them a mile off!! It's a good laugh
> though.
>
Apparently it's the experience that counts. Just having felt it give you
more time to react.
--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 75 2.0 TS (Badly bent) 155 TS
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 23:02:54 GMT, Catman
> wrote:

>Zathras wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:49:54 GMT, Catman
>> > wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>> Interesting bit in the Torygraph today about skid pan training though.
>>>Anyone up for booking a session?
>>
>> Trouble is that skid pans are often bigger than roads with no
>> on-coming traffic and you can spot them a mile off!! It's a good laugh
>> though.
>>
>Apparently it's the experience that counts. Just having felt it give you
>more time to react.

I know what you're saying but my experience is that you rarely get the
chance in real life to apply *that* experience in an effective way.
Once you're on ice, inertia is king! I'm saying that as someone who
has practiced on ice and snow and avoided one minor shunt and one
major crash as a result as well as being extremely confident in
slippery conditions.

In the case of the minor shunt it was getting a rear wheel drive back
on line after the tail unexpectedly slipped out (significantly on ice)
on a very tight road. The major one was coming over the brow of a hill
in snow to find sheet polished ice on the downside with spinning cars
and pedestrians scattered all the way down. The choices were to
deliberately crash my accelerating car off the road before piling into
the mayhem at the bottom or attempt some (frankly) magical handling
and steer round the mess. Upon complete failure of the former, I
managed the latter with the help of the handbrake I slalomed through
the carnage (coming out sideways). It was pure reaction stuff but with
hindsight I had so little real control because of the sheet ice that
the success came largely due to luck.

That was all a long time ago (we don't get decent snow these days)
when I used to deliberately go out driving in the snow for experience!
However, with my long experience of driving in general, I'd not get
myself into the previous situations at all nowadays.

Ask yourself this? From your accident, would you think you would have
managed to *handle* the car through the ice safely if you were some
kind of ice expert hitting it at the speed you did having not
anticipated it OR would success have been more likely if you had
simply anticipated the ice in advance and driven accordingly? I know
that sounds like some offensive toffee-nosed IAM tripe and I'm not
implying you didn't do the latter - I'm just interested in whether you
think the former was possible as a solution compared to the latter
IYSWIM!!!! 8-)

--
Z
Scotland
Alfa Romeo 156 2.4JTD Veloce Leather
'Oil' be seeing you..
(Email without 'Alfa' in subject are auto-deleted..sorry!)

"Zathras" wrote:

> >Apparently it's the experience that counts. Just having felt it give you
> >more time to react.
>
> I know what you're saying but my experience is that you rarely get the
> chance in real life to apply *that* experience in an effective way.
> Once you're on ice, inertia is king! I'm saying that as someone who
> has practiced on ice and snow and avoided one minor shunt and one
> major crash as a result as well as being extremely confident in
> slippery conditions.

I did some road rallying in my younger days when we had some hard winters.
This included a memorable descent on sheet ice. I agree with Zathras despite
the fact that we had the opportunity to gain experience sliding around in
the snow, though I would not have admitted it to my navigator at the time,
there were two passengers on the icy stuff!

Cheers
Tony

Zathras wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 23:02:54 GMT, Catman
> > wrote:
>
>>Zathras wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 22:49:54 GMT, Catman
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>> <snip>
>>>> Interesting bit in the Torygraph today about skid pan training though.
>>>>Anyone up for booking a session?
>>>
>>> Trouble is that skid pans are often bigger than roads with no
>>> on-coming traffic and you can spot them a mile off!! It's a good laugh
>>> though.
>>>
>>Apparently it's the experience that counts. Just having felt it give you
>>more time to react.
>
> I know what you're saying but my experience is that you rarely get the
> chance in real life to apply *that* experience in an effective way.

With respect, the writers of the article tend to dis-agree.

<snip>
> Ask yourself this? From your accident, would you think you would have
> managed to *handle* the car through the ice safely if you were some
> kind of ice expert hitting it at the speed you did having not
> anticipated it OR would success have been more likely if you had
> simply anticipated the ice in advance and driven accordingly? I know
> that sounds like some offensive toffee-nosed IAM tripe and I'm not
> implying you didn't do the latter - I'm just interested in whether you
> think the former was possible as a solution compared to the latter
> IYSWIM!!!! 8-)
>
No offence taken at all. I understand exactly where you're coming from and
look at it like this:
1) I've learnt that my anticipation of where and when ice forms needs work,
and will be monitored
2) Had I had more experience I *may* have been able to react quicker, and
more appropriately, perhaps reducing the the severity of the ultimate
impact.

Either way, I can't see it can do any harm. I'm not gonna think I'm Colin
McRae all of a sudden

--
Catman MIB#14 SKoGA#6 TEAR#4 BOTAFOF#38 Apostle#21 COSOC#3
Tyger, Tyger Burning Bright (Remove rust to reply)
Alfa 116 Giulietta 3.0l (Really) Sprint 1.7 75 2.0 TS (Badly bent) 155 TS
Triumph Speed Triple: Black with extra black bits
www.cuore-sportivo.co.uk