beautiful baby koi....

[~ Windsong ~]

This past spring our koi spawned for the first time. We had just cleaned
and refilled the pond so there wasn't much microscopic life for the babies
to live on - however about 10 did survive in the thickets of water plants on
the shelves. Of the 10 only one has poor coloring. The rest are golden
yellow, spotted, blue ...... I'm thrilled. :-)

Since feeding our koi and goldfish the catfish-food ($10 per 50 lbs) from
the local feed store they've grown like CRAZY! We mix it with about 30%
regular koi chow (small size) for the smaller fish in the ponds.
--
Carol.....
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic
and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."
- Theodore Roosevelt -
~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~

[Judi9000]

Congrats on your babies!
Do you know if it's ok to feed koi and goldfish CAT FOOD? Judi

[[email protected]]

it is not a good idea. cat food is cheap because it is made out of really cheap
ingredients, mostly grain. cat fish food, OTOH, is made to fatten them up fast cause
they are harvested in the first or second year so quality and the health of the fish
long term is not important.
our pet fish need higher quality higher protein and higher fat food for good health.
AND because we can feed so little of it and get fantastic growth. all food has
"bulk" or fiber that is not digested. cheap food has a great deal more of this that
high quality food. now the results of using cheap dog food is easily seen as much
bigger steaming piles of undigested matter (crap) compared to high quality food.
While those steaming piles may be spread out on a field or picked up, when fish are
crapping all that undigestible matter into the pond it just overloads the filter and
the fish have to swim in fouled water. Overfeeding even high quality food can do the
same thing.
the other issue is what GF and koi can digest. they have evolved to digest water
based food really well, mostly little animal critters with high protein, high fat,
low cellulose content. They dont digest carbohydrates well at all, so all that corn
and wheat in cheap food is in one end, out the other. So you can decide to feed high
quality food most of which is digested, feed very very little and dont foul the
water, or you can feed lots of the cheap food that does foul the water. Up to you.
Ingrid

(Judi9000) wrote:
>Congrats on your babies!
>Do you know if it's ok to feed koi and goldfish CAT FOOD? Judi



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Judi9000]

Thanks for the info. I was just curious because birds fly off with pieces of
our dogs food and sometimes they drop it in my ponds. The fish seem to love it.
I also have a friend that knows someone who feeds his koi cat food. Is it ok to
sometimes give the fish dog or cat food or to avoid it altogether? Also my fish
love oranges and lemons. Judi

[[email protected]]

you want to give the fish a real treat.... but small cocktail type shrimp for em.
Ingrid

(Judi9000) wrote:

>Thanks for the info. I was just curious because birds fly off with pieces of
>our dogs food and sometimes they drop it in my ponds. The fish seem to love it.
>I also have a friend that knows someone who feeds his koi cat food. Is it ok to
>sometimes give the fish dog or cat food or to avoid it altogether? Also my fish
>love oranges and lemons. Judi



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[[-M_a_t_r_i_x-]]

Every time I tried to feed my koi the cat food. I always got an "oily
rainbow sheen" on top of the water.
Anyone else get that?

[Judi9000]

You know, after reading your messages I decided to check out some other koi and
gf foods. I noticed that the first ingredient in all of them was wheat and the
second corn. What food do you use that doesn't have the grains as the first 2
ingredients? I also read somewhere that wheat germ based is best for the fish
when the temp.drops. Judi

[Judi9000]

I usually drop just a few pieces at a time so the water doesn't have a chance
to get oily. Judi

[Judi9000]

Where do you get the cocktail shrimp? And is it bad for the fish to eat lemons
and oranges? It seems like this would be a real healthy treat for them with all
the vitamin C. Judi

[~ jan JJsPond.us]

On 11 Nov 2003 05:00:30 GMT, (Judi9000) wrote:

>Where do you get the cocktail shrimp?

Same place you get ...

>And is it bad for the fish to eat lemons
>and oranges?

all of which are fine for them to be eating. My favorite process food is
ShoKoi & ShoGold www.pondepot.com or www.pondrx.com are a couple of places
that carry these. ~ jan
See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

[[email protected]]

Ogata and Grand Champion. actually what is best for fish when temps drop is romet B
for 2 weeks before quit feeding. it is antibiotic and saturates their tissue.
Ingrid

(Judi9000) wrote:

>You know, after reading your messages I decided to check out some other koi and
>gf foods. I noticed that the first ingredient in all of them was wheat and the
>second corn. What food do you use that doesn't have the grains as the first 2
>ingredients? I also read somewhere that wheat germ based is best for the fish
>when the temp.drops. Judi



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[[email protected]]

frozen food section of grocery. oranges are ok for the vitamins, but best is to keep
fish food frozen and that keeps vitamin C fresh., after 6 months however, the vit C
degrades. some people soak food in a bit of vit C liquid. I just get fresh food
Ingrid

(Judi9000) wrote:

>Where do you get the cocktail shrimp? And is it bad for the fish to eat lemons
>and oranges? It seems like this would be a real healthy treat for them with all
>the vitamin C. Judi



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[Judi9000]

thanks

[Judi9000]

thanks

[~ Windsong ~]

"Judi9000" > wrote in message
...
> Congrats on your babies!
> Do you know if it's ok to feed koi and goldfish CAT FOOD? Judi
================
Yes. But you can't beat the price of catfish food! :-) Maybe I'll get
some cat food next spring and give them more variety.
--
Carol.....
Don't go for looks; they can deceive.
Don't go for wealth; even that fades away.
Go for someone who makes you smile,
because it takes only a smile to
make a dark day seem bright.
Find the one that makes your heart smile.
~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~

[~ Windsong ~]

"Judi9000" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the info. I was just curious because birds fly off with pieces
of
> our dogs food and sometimes they drop it in my ponds. The fish seem to
love it.

## All I can tell you Judi is I'm feeding catfish food mixed with some
(around 30%, I'm not exact) more expensive koi/goldfish pellets and the
difference is AMAZING! They are not fat, they grew longer and their colors
are rich and beautiful. I see no need to spent $10 or $15 a lb for food
when they're thriving on the catfish/koi mix. This is the 3rd summer
they've been on this feeding regime and we haven't had one sick fish, or one
death.
The bottom of the pond has a thin coat of clean gravel where they koi
emptied a few plant pots. :-) There is no mulm or trash (poop and plant
matter) buildup since the filter return doesn't allow anything to "sit" on
the bottom and go sour. I don't seem to have the problem Ms Solo mentioned.

> I also have a friend that knows someone who feeds his koi cat food. Is it
ok to
> sometimes give the fish dog or cat food or to avoid it altogether? Also my
fish
> love oranges and lemons. Judi

## I also have friends who own ponds and feed cat food as treats. One guy
gives his koi those soft-moist dog patties that look like worms
(Ganesburgers perhaps ?). His fish go insane for them! Everyone here is
feeding catfish food to their koi and goldfish. That's where I learned
about it. After seeing these ponds and the healthy fish, I switched. I
haven't heard of any problems whatsoever. Why pay $10+ a lb when you can
get a 50lb bag for the same money?

Let me add.... if you do feed catfish food you don't need to feed huge
amounts for them to grow rapidly and reproduce. :-)

--
Carol.....
Don't go for looks; they can deceive.
Don't go for wealth; even that fades away.
Go for someone who makes you smile,
because it takes only a smile to
make a dark day seem bright.
Find the one that makes your heart smile.
~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~

[~ Windsong ~]

"Judi9000" > wrote in message
...
> You know, after reading your messages I decided to check out some other
koi and
> gf foods. I noticed that the first ingredient in all of them was wheat and
the
> second corn. What food do you use that doesn't have the grains as the
first 2
> ingredients? I also read somewhere that wheat germ based is best for the
fish
> when the temp.drops. Judi
=============
Here again Judi,.... not everyone takes this advice. Myself and my friends
feed our fish the SAME foods until the water gets around 55 F or lower -
then we stop feeding them altogether. No need to buy different foods.

--
Carol.....
Don't go for looks; they can deceive.
Don't go for wealth; even that fades away.
Go for someone who makes you smile,
because it takes only a smile to
make a dark day seem bright.
Find the one that makes your heart smile.
~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~

[~ Windsong ~]

"[-M_a_t_r_i_x-]" > wrote in message
...
> Every time I tried to feed my koi the cat food. I always got an "oily
> rainbow sheen" on top of the water.
> Anyone else get that?
==========================
I had this happen one time with an expensive fishy smelling koi food. The
fish loved this food as they love anything I toss in there at feeding time.
I honestly can't remember which brand it was as it was 4 or 5 years ago.
The oily sheen disappeared a few hours after feeding them. It did no harm
that I could see.
--
Carol.....
Don't go for looks; they can deceive.
Don't go for wealth; even that fades away.
Go for someone who makes you smile,
because it takes only a smile to
make a dark day seem bright.
Find the one that makes your heart smile.
~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~ ~*~

[[email protected]]

Cat fish food is for "food" fish, it is for quick growth so they get to market in
under 2 years. Food fish farmers dont care about the long term consequences of
feeding cheap foods. But my fish are pets, and I follow the recommendations of the
people who breed and raise koi for pets. They are every bit as eager to cut their
costs as the food fish producers, but obviously they are not finding it cost
effective to feed the cheap food to their koi. I prefer to follow the
recommendations of the experts when it comes to feeding my fish.
below is a reprint. Most people are overfeeding their fish which is both costly and
unhealthy for the fish. It isnt necessarily the total amount fed, but too much fed
at one time. Koi have very short intestines and the food is in and out quickly
(depending on water temp of course). Their normal feeding pattern is a little bit
all day long.

"Jo Ann and Steve got 77 koi in their big pond. they range from 5-20 lbs each
Steve gives them 2 pints of food per night (which weighs 16 oz), combination of Ogata
and Rangen. the RETAIL cost of feeding their monsters is:
6.5 cents per day per koi
45 cents per week per koi
23.63 bucks per year per koi cause they feed 365 days a year down there in Ala and
they heat their ponds. The koi are monsters and are still growing.

their 5 lb fish are around 18-22", so it averages out maybe to around 0.25 lbs per
inch for those big fish. a quick and dirty estimate of the average is they got 940
lbs of koi and feed 16 oz of food per day.

I am not sure how many koi I got. Lets say 25 koi from 6-14", I know they arent 0.25
lbs per inch, but lets say my 25 fish weigh in at 40 lbs. I should be feeding 1/24th
as much food as they do, or 2/3 of an ounce per day. Well, I think I feed more than
that cause I been feeding a bit less than 1/2 cup or around 1.2 oz of food per day.

Last year I bought
5 lbs of Rangen ($4/lb) $20.00
5 lbs of Ogata (5.50/lb) 27.50
5lbs of romet B ($4) 20.00
--------------------------------------------
67.50
I had Ogata left this spring been using it and will run out this week.
I have romet B left and I gave away at least half to people with sick fish.

I started feeding around April 15 when the water is above 55oF.
I quit feeding around Oct 8th. I didnt keep records on first and last feeding. But
this was around 25 weeks I fed the koi. Lets say 24 weeks cause I forget to feed
them every day. So 24 weeks X 7 days X 1.2 ounces per day = 201 ounces per year or
12.6 lbs. If I feed them according to Steve's rate, I should feed 110 ounces per
year or 6.9 lbs of food.
However, I feed 25 koi 12.6 lbs of food per year, average price is $5/lb or so comes
out to $2.50 per koi. Feeding at Steve's rate 6.9 lbs x $5 = 34.50 or $1.38 per koi
per year.
It doesnt add up right, I have more food left over so I may have missed more feedings
than I thought or not feed 1/2 cup. I dunno.
Yeah, that comes out to about 1/2 lb per year per fish.
High quality koi food is around $5 per lb.
High quality koi food has more digestible nutrition per ounce so I dont have to feed
as much and there is less waste coming out the other end to foul my water and foul my
filters. Anybody wanna feed catfish food to save a few bucks no skin off my nose.
I will feed my fish what experts like Brett feeds his." Ingrid


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
List Manager: Puregold Goldfish List
http://puregold.aquaria.net/
www.drsolo.com
Solve the problem, dont waste energy finding who's to blame
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Unfortunately, I receive no money, gifts, discounts or other
compensation for all the damn work I do, nor for any of the
endorsements or recommendations I make.

[~ Windsong ~]

> wrote in message
...
> Cat fish food is for "food" fish, it is for quick growth so they get to
market in
> under 2 years. Food fish farmers dont care about the long term
consequences of
> feeding cheap foods. But my fish are pets, and I follow the
recommendations of the
> people who breed and raise koi for pets.

** I follow whatever works best for my fish and they are thriving on the
catfish food, as are the fish of my friends. Why fix what isn't broken?
My koi and goldfish have been thriving and reproducing just fine. So are
theirs.
I was also told by a dog breeder from a dog newsgroup that my dogs would be
dead in a few years on inexpensive Wal-Mart dog food - >> SUPRISE << ....
they're now, 13, 11 and 10 years old! So far all three are still healthy.
OK, so one is hard of hearing now. :-) They're paying several times the
$$$ for all kinds of Deluxe and Designer brand dog foods.

They are every bit as eager to cut their
> costs as the food fish producers, but obviously they are not finding it
cost
> effective to feed the cheap food to their koi.

** You're talking about businesses, people in business to make money. You
can be sure they're not paying the $10 to $15+ a lb the dealers are charging
the public for these special-edition koi foods. Most of us with pet koi
are not looking to make money on our pets or raise thousands of fry a year.
All we want is a food that keeps them healthy, in good condition and to
enjoy watching a few baby fish. And catfish food fits the bill.

I prefer to follow the
> recommendations of the experts when it comes to feeding my fish.
> below is a reprint.

** The "experts" can come and check out my fish any time they want. :-)

Most people are overfeeding their fish which is both costly and
> unhealthy for the fish. It isnt necessarily the total amount fed, but too
much fed
> at one time. Koi have very short intestines and the food is in and out
quickly
> (depending on water temp of course). Their normal feeding pattern is a
little bit
> all day long.

** Overfeeding is another issue. I think most people learn fast enough how
much to feed per feeding after seeing slimy, furry food floating on the
surface at the next feeding time.

> "Jo Ann and Steve got 77 koi in their big pond. they range from 5-20 lbs
each
> Steve gives them 2 pints of food per night (which weighs 16 oz),
combination of Ogata
> and Rangen. the RETAIL cost of feeding their monsters is:
> 6.5 cents per day per koi
> 45 cents per week per koi
> 23.63 bucks per year per koi cause they feed 365 days a year down there in
Ala and
> they heat their ponds. The koi are monsters and are still growing.

** Jo Ann is in business and gets her feed wholesale, for one thing. Most
of us pet owners out here aren't buying in bulk. I have around 30 koi of
assorted sizes, and around 50 goldfish, some 8 to 10" long. It costs us
about $25.00 to $30.00 a year to feed them all. If I had 70 koi and 100
goldfish it would around $60.00 a year to feed them. Jo Ann is paying
$1,819.51 - big difference. Also,... since our fish never manage to eat the
whole 50 lbs, what's left is not kept over. It gets mixed in the Wal-Mart
food for the dogs. They love it.

Snipped list of figures for brevity.

Since all the ponds in my area are thriving, and all the fish reproducing,
we'll stick to catfish food and let those who feel they need a more
expensive food go for it!
--
Carol.....
I've learned that it takes years to build up trust, and it only
takes suspicion, not proof, to destroy it.
º¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~ º¤º°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~

[Judi9000]

That's the same kind of dog food we feed our dog. The birds sometimes drop
pieces in the ponds and the fish LOVE IT!!! Thanks .

[Judi9000]

I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard of
that one before!!! judi

[Judi9000]

Carol, as I was feeding my fish today, my cute little mini dachsund came up to
visit me and the fish. I had him do a few tricks for me and gave him some
pieces of the koi food. He loved it!!! Thanks for the cute idea. Judi

[Cichlidiot]

Judi9000 > wrote:
> I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard of
> that one before!!! judi

Well, when I was a teen, one of my cats LOVED the tropical flake food for
the tanks. She'd follow me at feeding time to clean up anything that
dropped. One day, she figured out where the canister was stored and chewed
it open and wolfed down a good deal of the fish food.... then went outside
and threw it all back up. She hasn't wanted fish food since, heh.

So... moral of this story is keep the food away from the pets that like
it lest they glut themselves much to their (and your) distress at the
gastronomical outcome of such glutting.

[Zookeeper]

Judi9000 wrote:
> I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard of
> that one before!!! judi

Our dogs also eat fish food. They beg and do their tricks, and I usually
give them a pellet or two. And if they don't get enough, they slurp it
out of the pond when it gets close enough to them.
--
Zk
3500gal pond, 13 pond piggies
Oregon, USDA Zone 7

[~ Windsong ~]

"Judi9000" > wrote in message
...
> I think that is sooo funny that your dogs eat the fish food! Never heard
of
> that one before!!! judi
========================
Dogs will eat almost anything, or at least all those I have ever owned did.
These 3 are no exception. When I feed my dogs I mix the leftover catfish
food with the dry Ol Roy dog food, table scraps of all kinds, 1/2 can of
some kind of meaty dog food and hot water. The only dog to ever get sick
and need the vet was the dobie who came down with erlicciosis (sp ?) from a
tick-bite.
--
Carol.....
I've learned that it takes years to build up trust, and it only
takes suspicion, not proof, to destroy it.
º¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~ º¤º°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~

[~ Windsong ~]

"Judi9000" > wrote in message
...
> Carol, as I was feeding my fish today, my cute little mini dachsund came
up to
> visit me and the fish. I had him do a few tricks for me and gave him some
> pieces of the koi food. He loved it!!! Thanks for the cute idea. Judi
==================
I believe he did! :-) My dogs also love cat food - any brand and in any
form. Dogs are natural born scavengers and from what I learned can handle a
wide range of foods. Their livers also produce starch splitters to help
digest carbohydrates in their diets. I was surprised to learn that.....
being they're carnivores.

In the late 1980s I had a large male mutt (shelter pup) who loved hunting
season. He'd drag home all the hunter's leavings after dressing out the
deer. Sometimes skeletons with little meat on them. Any deer nearby that
were hit by cars were also dragged home. He'd feast on them for days.
Now there's too much traffic and we keep the dogs in a huge fenced in area
when they go outside.
--
Carol.....
I've learned that it takes years to build up trust, and it only
takes suspicion, not proof, to destroy it.
º¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~ º¤º°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤º ~*~ ~*~

[Tom La Bron]

Judi,

First of all, you have seen a number of people chime in and tell you that
they are feeding Cat food to their fish with great results. Personally,
over the years I have feed my fish Cat food, but in the last 10 years I have
stuck with foods that are aquaculture related for feeding my stock.

If you are going to feed Cat food make sure you make it a size that the fish
can eat easily. Personally, I would look for a cat food that is of the
softer variety, mainly because it would be easier for Goldfish to eat,
should they get a hold of a larger piece.

It is interesting to note that Ingrid uses Jo Ann and Steve as examples.
These people are LFS owners, or were, I understand they are getting out of
the business, but she mentions that they use Ogata and Rangen feeds to feed
their KOI. It is interesting to point out that she uses the figures for
retail cost per year for feeding the fish, but I imagine that even though
she is using retail costs it is probably based on the retail cost of the
food bought in bulk rather than buying the food one kilo at a time. This
means that in bulk the retail cost works out to $3.84 per pound instead of
$13.57 a pound if you buy it just a kilo at a time, like many people would
for their fish.

Another point to make is that Rangen does not make a food for KOI or
Goldfish. This means that out of the 34 foods that Rangen is producing
they are using a food not designated for KOI and Goldfish, which in the past
she has derided people in the past for using Catfish foods for KOI, which
happens to be a food they do make. The other foods produced by Rangen are
meant for Salmon, Trout, Talipia and Shrimp and are not blended for KOI and
Goldfish.

Plus Ingrid tells us that Steve dumps a pint a food in every night to feed
their fish. This goes against, even her message of small multiple meals
through out the day, which is actually a more prudent way of feeding your
fish. So it looks like even Jo Ann and Steve don't feed their fish
correctly according to what Ingrid always tells every one else do because of
how and what they feed.

So what can be learned from this, you have to remember that Goldfish and KOI
are omnivores which allows them to acquire their nutrients from a variety of
food sources. The mantra that Ingrid brings us about high protein, low carb
is just wrong. Nothing supports this, in fact, every thing in research
supports 28 to 32% protein being the best for KOI and Goldfish. In fact,
for wintering fish the KOI specialist all tout increase carbs just before
winter to allow fat build up to sustain the fish through the cold winter
months when no additional feeding is done by the owner.

Obviously what works for Jo Ann and Steve works for them, so you need to
find out what works for you. But there are not set rules. If you read the
back files you will find people feeding dog food, cat food, catfish food and
all with good results. Most of the time when people start out it is not
expensive enough to worry about the price of the food you are feeding, but
as you acquire fish and your numbers go up food prices can get astronomical.
I, myself, buy a top grade Goldfish food, but I buy it bulk so my price is
substantially lower than the $12 to $14 per pound it normally costs,
depending on where you get it and if your get it locally or via mail order
when you have to also add in to shipping and handling costs on the per pound
rate.

Ingrid would have you believe if you read all of her responses on this one
thread alone that aquaculture farmers don't care about what they feed their
stock. That is a bunch of Horse Crap. Virtually all of the Aquaculture
feeds that I have researched are made to exacting and precise methods and
have the same bells and whistles in them that any high quality fish food
would have including the fancy Japanese brands.

HTH

Tom L.L.
"Judi9000" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for the info. I was just curious because birds fly off with pieces
of
> our dogs food and sometimes they drop it in my ponds. The fish seem to
love it.
> I also have a friend that knows someone who feeds his koi cat food. Is it
ok to
> sometimes give the fish dog or cat food or to avoid it altogether? Also my
fish
> love oranges and lemons. Judi

[Theo van Daele]

Tom,

What about the idea that cat food can swell incredibly in water, not a real
problem for cats, but Koi having almost no stomach to speak of, isn't that a
real risk ?

Can I also ask why you decided to stick to aquaculture food now ?

Theo

"Tom La Bron" > schreef in bericht
...
> Judi,
>
> First of all, you have seen a number of people chime in and tell you that
> they are feeding Cat food to their fish with great results. Personally,
> over the years I have feed my fish Cat food, but in the last 10 years I
have
> stuck with foods that are aquaculture related for feeding my stock.

[Gale Pearce]

Yup - I got that when I used trout chow (Purina) - its the oil in the food
leeching out
Gale :~)

"[-M_a_t_r_i_x-]" > wrote in message
...
> Every time I tried to feed my koi the cat food. I always got an "oily
> rainbow sheen" on top of the water.
> Anyone else get that?
>

[Tom La Bron]

Theo,

The swelling of the food was the main reason I suggested that the food used
be broken up into small pieces and/or soft foods used. When I was trying
this I used "Meow Mix" which is a soft food.

The reason I stick with Aquaculture foods is because they have a lot more of
the vitamins needed by fish than foods for land animals and they usually
also have a higher vit C content than land animal foods. Another thing is
that most of your Aquaculture foods are now making sure that Omega-three
additives are making it into their foods. But when all is said and done the
main reason is that most of your Aquaculture foods are a lot cheaper when
bought in bulk. The amounts of food that I feed I certainly can't afford
$14 a pound much less $25 a pound.

Tom L.L.
"Theo van Daele" > wrote in message
...
> Tom,
>
> What about the idea that cat food can swell incredibly in water, not a
real
> problem for cats, but Koi having almost no stomach to speak of, isn't that
a
> real risk ?
>
> Can I also ask why you decided to stick to aquaculture food now ?
>
> Theo
>
> "Tom La Bron" > schreef in bericht
> ...
> > Judi,
> >
> > First of all, you have seen a number of people chime in and tell you
that
> > they are feeding Cat food to their fish with great results. Personally,
> > over the years I have feed my fish Cat food, but in the last 10 years I
> have
> > stuck with foods that are aquaculture related for feeding my stock.
>
>

[Judi9000]

Very interesting. Thanks.