guppy/fungus/dying

[Nikki]

I usually post on alt.aquaria.tropical.fish.hobbist, I had posted a problem
I was having and netmax said to post it here, and maybe someone could help.
I have had a lot going on in my tanks so I will try and make it short

Had guppy tank set up for a year, had only 2 African dwarf frogs, 1 male
/female guppy, the female was pregnant had babies three times since
Christmas, babies were all fine up had no problems with them, both guppies
were healthy
then because I needed to have more females I went to lfs which was closing
and they had 8 guppies left so I just got them, still ended up with more
males then females but anyway, I made a mistake since at that time I had
both sets of babies in a 5 gl tank that I had, which was usually used for
either sick fish or new fish, I had no place to put them and put them in
with my guppies (yes I am aware that was a dumb move) it was a small
petstore and she did not take good care of the fish, some of the males were
nipping at the two pregnant females so I got a divider put males on one
side/ older babies and females on the other side and put one of those net
square things so the younger babies could be in the tank with out being
eaten, a few days after getting the new guppies I lost some, but they did
not look great to begin with, the following day I noticed white stuff on a
few of them, looked like cotton, I also noticed it on some of the babies,
they died fast, I took out the African dwarf frogs and treated with jungle
ick stuff, I still had some dying after treating mostly babies and older
babies, no adults, I seen cotton stuff on two of them and used a q-tip and
put hydrogen peroxide on it, they seemed to clear up fine and seem to be
fine now, but I am still losing babies at least one or two each day, and the
ones who died I have noticed that white stuff on them.
any suggestions would help, i think its a fungus
i have two ick meds one just for ick and the other says its for ick and
fungus, i have also read it might be Cytophaga?
Nikki
Does anyone know if African dwarf frogs can get fungus i dont think they get
ick

[Altum]

Nikki wrote:
> I usually post on alt.aquaria.tropical.fish.hobbist, I had posted a problem
> I was having and netmax said to post it here, and maybe someone could help.
> I have had a lot going on in my tanks so I will try and make it short
>
> Had guppy tank set up for a year, had only 2 African dwarf frogs, 1 male
> /female guppy, the female was pregnant had babies three times since
> Christmas, babies were all fine up had no problems with them, both guppies
> were healthy
> then because I needed to have more females I went to lfs which was closing
> and they had 8 guppies left so I just got them, still ended up with more
> males then females but anyway, I made a mistake since at that time I had
> both sets of babies in a 5 gl tank that I had, which was usually used for
> either sick fish or new fish, I had no place to put them and put them in
> with my guppies (yes I am aware that was a dumb move) it was a small
> petstore and she did not take good care of the fish, some of the males were
> nipping at the two pregnant females so I got a divider put males on one
> side/ older babies and females on the other side and put one of those net
> square things so the younger babies could be in the tank with out being
> eaten, a few days after getting the new guppies I lost some, but they did
> not look great to begin with, the following day I noticed white stuff on a
> few of them, looked like cotton, I also noticed it on some of the babies,
> they died fast, I took out the African dwarf frogs and treated with jungle
> ick stuff, I still had some dying after treating mostly babies and older
> babies, no adults, I seen cotton stuff on two of them and used a q-tip and
> put hydrogen peroxide on it, they seemed to clear up fine and seem to be
> fine now, but I am still losing babies at least one or two each day, and the
> ones who died I have noticed that white stuff on them.
> any suggestions would help, i think its a fungus
> i have two ick meds one just for ick and the other says its for ick and
> fungus, i have also read it might be Cytophaga?
> Nikki
> Does anyone know if African dwarf frogs can get fungus i dont think they get
> ick
>
>
We need a bit more information.

1) How large is the tank and what are all the fish?
2) How often to do you change water? How much?
3) Have you tested for ammonia, nitrate, nitrate, and the pH? What were
the results?
4) Why did you use an ich medicine on cottony growths? Ich is not fuzzy
at all. It looks like individual grains of salt. Use Google to search
for pictures if you're not sure what ich looks like.

Whatever it is, it sounds like the infection is under control. The
Q-tip with peroxide was a good choice. Dead fish can grow fungus very
rapidly depending on your tank conditions so don't worry about fuzzies
on anything that is dead. I wouldn't add any more medication unless
there is actually ich.

Baby guppies are very sensitive to water quality problems and
medications. I suspect the ich medicine stressed them (particularly if
it contains copper) and that your water quality isn't ideal. Put fresh
carbon in your filter to remove any traces of medicine and change 1/3 of
the water daily for the next week. Be sure to match temps so you don't
shock the babies.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Richard Sexton]

In article >,
Nikki > wrote:
>I usually post on alt.aquaria.tropical.fish.hobbist, I had posted a problem

My bad. I meant "hobbyist" and f'ed up the group creation message with
a typo a long time ago. Sigh.


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Altum]

Richard Sexton wrote:
> In article >,
> Nikki > wrote:
>
>>I usually post on alt.aquaria.tropical.fish.hobbist, I had posted a problem
>
>
> My bad. I meant "hobbyist" and f'ed up the group creation message with
> a typo a long time ago. Sigh.
>
At least you could create a new alt group and have it propagated back then.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Altum]

Altum wrote:
> Richard Sexton wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> Nikki > wrote:
>>
>>> I usually post on alt.aquaria.tropical.fish.hobbist, I had posted a
>>> problem
>>
>>
>>
>> My bad. I meant "hobbyist" and f'ed up the group creation message with
>> a typo a long time ago. Sigh.
>>
> At least you could create a new alt group and have it propagated back then.
>
Scratch that. It's not on my normal newsserver.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Nikki]

>>
> We need a bit more information.
>
> 1) How large is the tank and what are all the fish?

guppies/ ten gl with divider
5 males on one side / two pregnant females, five young guppies about 2
months old and 2 african dwarf frogs (got a divider because after i lost
some females the males would not stop nipping at the last two females, and i
dont want to add any females because of the problems going on)


> 2) How often to do you change water? How much?

20-30% about every week, also vaccume

> 3) Have you tested for ammonia, nitrate, nitrate, and the pH? What were
> the results?

I took it to my LPS to have it checked three times, which she did i think
because she knew when she sold me the guppies they had ick, she was shuting
down her store and had some problems with her tanks, she did not look
suprised when i told her they had ick, anyway she said my water was fine.
Yes i am aware with fish tanks i should do that stuff my self, but i have
had a 75, 55, 29 gl set up for years and never once had problems with them,
never had sick fish, but they were big fish, i had 2 Black pacu's in one,
oscars in another, and in my 29 i have a gurami and a big goldfish (i know
they dont go well together but they have been together for almost two years)

> 4) Why did you use an ich medicine on cottony growths? Ich is not fuzzy
> at all. It looks like individual grains of salt. Use Google to search
> for pictures if you're not sure what ich looks like.

Yes i know what ick looks like, the new guppies i got from the petstore had
ick, after treating the first time i did not see it again, but i started to
see the cotton stuff after that, i did use the ick med again because it said
it was for ick, fungus, bacteria

>
> Whatever it is, it sounds like the infection is under control. The Q-tip
> with peroxide was a good choice. Dead fish can grow fungus very rapidly
> depending on your tank conditions so don't worry about fuzzies on anything
> that is dead. I wouldn't add any more medication unless there is actually
> ich.

all the adults now look fine to me, however the young guppies i have still
noticed it on a few of them, and i have lost some fry that are about three
weeks but i did expect that since they are young


> Baby guppies are very sensitive to water quality problems and medications.
> I suspect the ich medicine stressed them (particularly if it contains
> copper) and that your water quality isn't ideal. Put fresh carbon in your
> filter to remove any traces of medicine and change 1/3 of the water daily
> for the next week. Be sure to match temps so you don't shock the babies.

I am worried since some of the young guppies are still showing fungus the
adults may get it, does salt help for this i am wondering

thank you for your help
Nikki

>
> --
> Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
> Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Nikki]

one more thing, i use bloodworms (fishfood) for my ADF does that cause any
problems with disease in the tank? i also feed that to my betta's
Nikki



"Altum" > wrote in message
. com...
> Nikki wrote:
>> I usually post on alt.aquaria.tropical.fish.hobbist, I had posted a
>> problem I was having and netmax said to post it here, and maybe someone
>> could help.
>> I have had a lot going on in my tanks so I will try and make it short
>>
>> Had guppy tank set up for a year, had only 2 African dwarf frogs, 1 male
>> /female guppy, the female was pregnant had babies three times since
>> Christmas, babies were all fine up had no problems with them, both
>> guppies were healthy
>> then because I needed to have more females I went to lfs which was
>> closing and they had 8 guppies left so I just got them, still ended up
>> with more males then females but anyway, I made a mistake since at that
>> time I had both sets of babies in a 5 gl tank that I had, which was
>> usually used for either sick fish or new fish, I had no place to put them
>> and put them in with my guppies (yes I am aware that was a dumb move) it
>> was a small petstore and she did not take good care of the fish, some of
>> the males were nipping at the two pregnant females so I got a divider put
>> males on one side/ older babies and females on the other side and put one
>> of those net square things so the younger babies could be in the tank
>> with out being eaten, a few days after getting the new guppies I lost
>> some, but they did not look great to begin with, the following day I
>> noticed white stuff on a few of them, looked like cotton, I also noticed
>> it on some of the babies, they died fast, I took out the African dwarf
>> frogs and treated with jungle ick stuff, I still had some dying after
>> treating mostly babies and older babies, no adults, I seen cotton stuff
>> on two of them and used a q-tip and put hydrogen peroxide on it, they
>> seemed to clear up fine and seem to be fine now, but I am still losing
>> babies at least one or two each day, and the ones who died I have noticed
>> that white stuff on them.
>> any suggestions would help, i think its a fungus
>> i have two ick meds one just for ick and the other says its for ick and
>> fungus, i have also read it might be Cytophaga?
>> Nikki
>> Does anyone know if African dwarf frogs can get fungus i dont think they
>> get ick
>>
>>
> We need a bit more information.
>
> 1) How large is the tank and what are all the fish?
> 2) How often to do you change water? How much?
> 3) Have you tested for ammonia, nitrate, nitrate, and the pH? What were
> the results?
> 4) Why did you use an ich medicine on cottony growths? Ich is not fuzzy
> at all. It looks like individual grains of salt. Use Google to search
> for pictures if you're not sure what ich looks like.
>
> Whatever it is, it sounds like the infection is under control. The Q-tip
> with peroxide was a good choice. Dead fish can grow fungus very rapidly
> depending on your tank conditions so don't worry about fuzzies on anything
> that is dead. I wouldn't add any more medication unless there is actually
> ich.
>
> Baby guppies are very sensitive to water quality problems and medications.
> I suspect the ich medicine stressed them (particularly if it contains
> copper) and that your water quality isn't ideal. Put fresh carbon in your
> filter to remove any traces of medicine and change 1/3 of the water daily
> for the next week. Be sure to match temps so you don't shock the babies.
>
> --
> Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
> Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Altum]

Nikki wrote:
> one more thing, i use bloodworms (fishfood) for my ADF does that cause any
> problems with disease in the tank? i also feed that to my betta's
> Nikki

Freeze dried are rarely a problem. Frozen ones can be a problem
depending on how well sterilized they are. They also foul the tank if
the're too old.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Altum]

Nikki wrote:

> I am worried since some of the young guppies are still showing fungus the
> adults may get it, does salt help for this i am wondering

Salt can help for fungus but I don't know whether ADF like it. You
might want to isolate the babies to keep the adults healthy, salt them,
and see what happens. As long as the adults stay healthy, there will be
plenty more babies!

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Nikki]

something i noticed was if i put them in at night (they are the ones you get
at the petstore in the fishfood container) they have fungus on them by
morning, and another thing that i have never seen before that i am seeing
now is even the flake food i feed the guppies has fungus on it, i dont feed
them a lot so there is not a lot of it but last night i feed them flakes and
i notices a couple flakes in the morning at the bottom and they had white
stuff on them, and before now i never seen that. i got it out with the net,
it was only like 2-9 pieces but that is strange i wonder if it has something
to do with the blood worms or the fungus from the fish...
Nikki





"Altum" > wrote in message
. net...
> Nikki wrote:
>> one more thing, i use bloodworms (fishfood) for my ADF does that cause
>> any problems with disease in the tank? i also feed that to my betta's
>> Nikki
>
> Freeze dried are rarely a problem. Frozen ones can be a problem depending
> on how well sterilized they are. They also foul the tank if the're too
> old.
>
> --
> Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
> Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[Altum]

Nikki wrote:
> something i noticed was if i put them in at night (they are the ones you get
> at the petstore in the fishfood container) they have fungus on them by
> morning, and another thing that i have never seen before that i am seeing
> now is even the flake food i feed the guppies has fungus on it, i dont feed
> them a lot so there is not a lot of it but last night i feed them flakes and
> i notices a couple flakes in the morning at the bottom and they had white
> stuff on them, and before now i never seen that. i got it out with the net,
> it was only like 2-9 pieces but that is strange i wonder if it has something
> to do with the blood worms or the fungus from the fish...
> Nikki

It's nothing to do with the bloodworms. You are overfeeding and your
tank has some water quality problems that are favoring the growth of
fungus on everything. I know you're an experienced fishkeeper and you
think you're not feeding a lot, but I think you're overestimating the
amount of food guppies can eat. My guppies never leave food overnight!
Properly fed, healthy guppies are always picking at the gravel,
plants and decorations hunting for food and they rarely miss anything.

You said you took your water to LFS to test it. What, exactly, is fine
to your fish store? Did they tell you the numbers or show you the test
results? You cannot adequately monitor increasing nitrates and falling
pH (what I bet is happening in your guppy tank) without testing.

I still think you need to start changing about a third of the water a
day and really cleaning the gravel for the next week or so. Also put
fresh, high-quality carbon in your filter to help the water quality.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

[snabba]

try doing a search on columnaris it usually causes white cotton like
patches on the head and mouth region of a fish it's common in guppies
and can cause a shimmying efffect in live bearers. I also have a guppy
tank You should join guppies.com they have a forum there with alot of
knowlegable(sp?) people on there. Anytime I have a problem with my gupps
that's where I go to.



--
Posted via CichlidFish.com
http://www.cichlidfish.com/portal/forums

[Nikki]

I have got a lot of useful info on guppy.com but never joined but I will,
the white stuff is mostly on the tail area and back, I had read that about
it being on the head and mouth that's why I was not sure. thanks
Nikki



"snabba" -DONTEMAIL> wrote in message
...
> try doing a search on columnaris it usually causes white cotton like
> patches on the head and mouth region of a fish it's common in guppies
> and can cause a shimmying efffect in live bearers. I also have a guppy
> tank You should join guppies.com they have a forum there with alot of
> knowlegable(sp?) people on there. Anytime I have a problem with my gupps
> that's where I go to.
>
>
>
> --
> Posted via CichlidFish.com
> http://www.cichlidfish.com/portal/forums

[snabba]

all of the uneaten food no matter what kind it is will look like it has
a fungus on it if it's sat overnight I've seen it plenty of times I
think it's just the food disolving but I scoop it out anyway cuz they
aren't going to eat it at that point and you shouldn't just leave it
there to decay.



--
Posted via CichlidFish.com
http://www.cichlidfish.com/portal/forums

[Koi-Lo]

"snabba" -DONTEMAIL> wrote in message
...
> all of the uneaten food no matter what kind it is will look like it has
> a fungus on it if it's sat overnight I've seen it plenty of times I
> think it's just the food disolving but I scoop it out anyway cuz they
> aren't going to eat it at that point and you shouldn't just leave it
> there to decay.
==========================
A few small cory cats would take care of that dropped food. They will also
probably help the tank from becoming overcrowded with guppies down the road.
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Mr. Gardener]

On Mon, 6 Mar 2006 22:14:22 -0600, "Koi-Lo" >
wrote:

>
>"snabba" -DONTEMAIL> wrote in message
...
>> all of the uneaten food no matter what kind it is will look like it has
>> a fungus on it if it's sat overnight I've seen it plenty of times I
>> think it's just the food disolving but I scoop it out anyway cuz they
>> aren't going to eat it at that point and you shouldn't just leave it
>> there to decay.
>==========================
>A few small cory cats would take care of that dropped food. They will also
>probably help the tank from becoming overcrowded with guppies down the road.

Adding corys to pick up the dropped food would be a temporary bandaid
at best. If food is fungusing overnight, the tank has got some
problems far bigger than a few little corys can handle. It sounds like
some serious water quality issues here. Time for some serious
cleaning.

-- Mister Gardener

[Koi-Lo]

"Mr. Gardener" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 6 Mar 2006 22:14:22 -0600, "Koi-Lo" >
>>A few small cory cats would take care of that dropped food. They will
>>also
>>probably help the tank from becoming overcrowded with guppies down the
>>road.
>
> Adding corys to pick up the dropped food would be a temporary bandaid
> at best. If food is fungusing overnight, the tank has got some
> problems far bigger than a few little corys can handle. It sounds like
> some serious water quality issues here. Time for some serious
> cleaning.
==================
Some people are perpetual over-feeders or their children insist on feeding
(way too much) in which case a few small corys will soon become a few big
fat corys. But I agree that better tank maintenance is in order. Less
feeding and more gravel vacuuming to start with (partial water changes go
without saying). Most people eventually learn how much to feed per feeding
so it doesn't land on the bottom and get fungused.
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>

[Nikki]

they were getting no more or less food then they have for as long as the
tank has been set up and i never had that problem before, however it was
only the bloodworms that had fuzz on them, not flakes (which i thought did
because the bloodworms did, and there is not a lot of food on the bottom, i
only have about half the rocks as normal in the tank because i threw some
away, (discolored from med) in a good part of the tank i can see the bare
bottom of the tank and there is no food laying there, i did fish out the
blood worms because they did not eat them and some were stuck behind my
filter, and i did have a new flake food that i got and for what ever reason
they did not eat or like it, and I went back to their normal food, i do not
over feed them, i probably underfeed them, but they were not eating the new
flakes and i did not notice right off the bat so there was some food that
got left, but normaly they eat what i put in .
thanks nikki
my tank is for the most part clean, i do water changes, i had bought guppies
that had ick and was having some problems with the tank after that, so i was
changing water more then i would under normal circumstances.




"Koi-Lo" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Mr. Gardener" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Mon, 6 Mar 2006 22:14:22 -0600, "Koi-Lo" >
>>>A few small cory cats would take care of that dropped food. They will
>>>also
>>>probably help the tank from becoming overcrowded with guppies down the
>>>road.
>>
>> Adding corys to pick up the dropped food would be a temporary bandaid
>> at best. If food is fungusing overnight, the tank has got some
>> problems far bigger than a few little corys can handle. It sounds like
>> some serious water quality issues here. Time for some serious
>> cleaning.
> ==================
> Some people are perpetual over-feeders or their children insist on feeding
> (way too much) in which case a few small corys will soon become a few big
> fat corys. But I agree that better tank maintenance is in order. Less
> feeding and more gravel vacuuming to start with (partial water changes go
> without saying). Most people eventually learn how much to feed per
> feeding so it doesn't land on the bottom and get fungused.
> --
> Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
> Aquariums since 1952
> My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
> http://tinyurl.com/9do58
> Note: There are two Koi-Lo's on the Aquaria groups.
> ~~~ }<((((o> ~~~ }<{{{{o> ~~~ }<(((((o>
>
>
>
>

[Richard Sexton]

>> Adding corys to pick up the dropped food would be a temporary bandaid
>> at best.

>Some people are perpetual over-feeders or their children insist on feeding
>(way too much) in which case a few small corys will soon become a few big
>fat corys.

And in this cae insteadof too much food, there's too much fish waste. Just
because there's no exces food does't mean your problems are over.

If you want to see this for yourself, set up a planted tank with
only snails and shrimp and no gravel. Now marvel at how much
waste those bugers can produce, It's increadable.

Take a look at the AGA show winning tanks and notice how clear
and clean they are and how few aniumals are actually in them.


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

[Nikki]

I don't have a lot of fish in this tank, about ten guppies, and I vacuumed i
see how much waste
there is, but I stay on top of it, any way I have it taken care of it now,
it took me a few days to see they were not eating the new flakes and I
vacuumed it up, and the bloodworms they did not eat
thanks Nikki




"Richard Sexton" > wrote in message
...
>>> Adding corys to pick up the dropped food would be a temporary bandaid
>>> at best.
>
>>Some people are perpetual over-feeders or their children insist on feeding
>>(way too much) in which case a few small corys will soon become a few big
>>fat corys.
>
> And in this cae insteadof too much food, there's too much fish waste. Just
> because there's no exces food does't mean your problems are over.
>
> If you want to see this for yourself, set up a planted tank with
> only snails and shrimp and no gravel. Now marvel at how much
> waste those bugers can produce, It's increadable.
>
> Take a look at the AGA show winning tanks and notice how clear
> and clean they are and how few aniumals are actually in them.
>
>
> --
> Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
> Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
> 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
> 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net