Temperature Problems

Hi,

Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm, given
the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29
(early evening /later afternoon). I have had two confimred casuities, and
possibly two more. To which end I have checked my parameters and these seem
stable (ph 7.6, kh 15dkh, GH 16 dkh, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10, NH4 0).

I can get a fan to move the air around the tank, however this will be about
2 metres away. I also work shifts, so on some days during the warmest part,
I may not be here to make any water changes during the warmest part of the
day (note however I *do* carry out my regualr water changes, approximatly
every 6 days).

I would be able to place a standard Fan closer to the aquarium, that was an
option, as I could pick one up quite easily and cheaply, have it a lot
closer.

Any other suggestions ??

Thanks in advance,

Geoff

On Thu, 20 May 2004 10:08:43 +0100, "Geoff Kemp"
wrote:

Hi,

Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm, given
the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29
(early evening /later afternoon). I have had two confimred casuities, and
possibly two more. To which end I have checked my parameters and these seem
stable (ph 7.6, kh 15dkh, GH 16 dkh, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10, NH4 0).

I can get a fan to move the air around the tank, however this will be about
2 metres away. I also work shifts, so on some days during the warmest part,
I may not be here to make any water changes during the warmest part of the
day (note however I *do* carry out my regualr water changes, approximatly
every 6 days).

I would be able to place a standard Fan closer to the aquarium, that was an
option, as I could pick one up quite easily and cheaply, have it a lot
closer.

Any other suggestions ??

Thanks in advance,

Geoff

You say "get a fan to move the air around the tank...."

It may be your choice of words, but to get the evaporation to carry
off the heat, the hood must be off and the air flow across the water.
It is the evaporation which carries off the heat from the tank and why
the water must be added to make up for the evaporation. I would also
have a bubbler to aid motion to the water. Your weekly changes may
not be enough to manage the added minerals left behind from the
evaporation. I hope you get more and better suggestions. I am
repeating what I have read.

There have been other discussions of heat removal in the last month.
You are not alone.

On Thu, 20 May 2004 10:08:43 +0100, Geoff Kemp wrote:
Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.

I'm in East London, near Essex.

Anyway, http://www.gorge.org/fish/weather.shtml has some ideas.




--
Flash Wilson
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Looking for a UNIX/Apache Sysadmin, or help with your website?
Drop me an email! Available across London or working from home.

The cheapest solution (but ugly) would be an Office style fan, one of the
big ones, with the air flow directed along the water surface.

You could buy a chiller!

You are always going to have problems holding temperatures stable in a small
tank, but 4 degrees C is more manageable for some fish than others.
Increasing your airpump output would also help.


Mark

"Flash Wilson" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 20 May 2004 10:08:43 +0100, Geoff Kemp
wrote:
Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve
been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.

I'm in East London, near Essex.

Anyway, http://www.gorge.org/fish/weather.shtml has some ideas.




--
Flash Wilson
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Looking for a UNIX/Apache Sysadmin, or help with your website?
Drop me an email! Available across London or working from home.

"Geoff Kemp" wrote:
Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm, given
the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29
(early evening /later afternoon). I have had two confimred casuities, and
possibly two more. To which end I have checked my parameters and these seem
stable (ph 7.6, kh 15dkh, GH 16 dkh, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10, NH4 0).

I can get a fan to move the air around the tank, however this will be about
2 metres away. I also work shifts, so on some days during the warmest part,
I may not be here to make any water changes during the warmest part of the
day (note however I *do* carry out my regualr water changes, approximatly
every 6 days).

I would be able to place a standard Fan closer to the aquarium, that was an
option, as I could pick one up quite easily and cheaply, have it a lot
closer.

Any other suggestions ??

Without knowing the fish, perhaps just setting the heater to maintain 29?
That's more than a tad warmish, but I'd think it would be better on the fish
than the wild temperature swings.

"Geoff Kemp" wrote in message
...
Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve
been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm,
given
the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29


I think you're going to have serious problems in July & August. My
Tank gets virtually no natural sunlight, yet I lost some fish when the
temperature went up to 100% F last summer.

I have a Juwel tank, so I opened both feeding flaps and played
a fan over the water surface. This dramatically reduced the temperature
and I lost no more fish. Evaporation runs at about 2-3 gallons a week, but
I change 25-33% of the tank water every week anyway.

But with your tank in a West facing window I don't think this will be
enough, especially if you've already lost fish. Have you considered
screening the tank from sunlight during the day. A simple screen
would make a huge difference and keep algae down ?

Most of the deaths BTW are from lack of oxygen, not cooking :-)
Hot water holds less O2 than cold water, so keeping the number
of fish in the tank down really helps.

--
Edward Cowling - London - UK

Geoff Kemp wrote:
Hi,

Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm, given
the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29
(early evening /later afternoon). I have had two confimred casuities, and
possibly two more. To which end I have checked my parameters and these seem
stable (ph 7.6, kh 15dkh, GH 16 dkh, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10, NH4 0).

I can get a fan to move the air around the tank, however this will be about
2 metres away. I also work shifts, so on some days during the warmest part,
I may not be here to make any water changes during the warmest part of the
day (note however I *do* carry out my regualr water changes, approximatly
every 6 days).

I would be able to place a standard Fan closer to the aquarium, that was an
option, as I could pick one up quite easily and cheaply, have it a lot
closer.

Any other suggestions ??

Thanks in advance,

Geoff



I'd say that you might want to look at upping the general temp of the
tank by a couple of degrees on a permanent basis (gradually) thus
lessening the daily swing of the temp.

I have a community tank, and even in the height of summer last year had
no deaths, with the tank regularly at 31-33C during the day (in a room
that faces both south-east and north-west - double aspect). The tank
gets no direct sunlight.

Of late, it's been sat at around that temp off and on (faulty heaterstat
gradually getting worse) and again no fatalities.

I have a well planted (well, it was until the latest bout of high temps
in it, coupled with a frisky pair of breeding angelfish) tank which I
think helps keep the O2 levels up in the water in the heat too.

Keep the curtains closed on that room to help stop the temp buildup in
the first place, bubble extra air through the tank. What others have
said about the air blowing across the top is right, that's the best way
to achieve cooling, but you'll also have to keep up the water changes to
stop excessive loss through evap, and also reduce the minerals etc left
behind.

If you can get extra air vents in the hood then do that, think about
maybe reducing the lights that are on at peak temp time.

Fish should be fairly resilient if they're common-or-garden(ish)
tropicals, as long as you let them get used to the higher temp
gradually, which is why I suggested upping the temp by 2C of the tank as
a base line for it.

Am presuming you don't have ammonia present in the tank, I can't
remember if ammonia gets more nasty at a higher temp or not, it's been a
while since I've had to worry about that in mine.

--


Velvet

Edward Cowling wrote:
"Geoff Kemp" wrote in message
...

Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve

been

having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm,

given

the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29



I think you're going to have serious problems in July & August. My
Tank gets virtually no natural sunlight, yet I lost some fish when the
temperature went up to 100% F last summer.

I have a Juwel tank, so I opened both feeding flaps and played
a fan over the water surface. This dramatically reduced the temperature
and I lost no more fish. Evaporation runs at about 2-3 gallons a week, but
I change 25-33% of the tank water every week anyway.

But with your tank in a West facing window I don't think this will be
enough, especially if you've already lost fish. Have you considered
screening the tank from sunlight during the day. A simple screen
would make a huge difference and keep algae down ?

Most of the deaths BTW are from lack of oxygen, not cooking :-)
Hot water holds less O2 than cold water, so keeping the number
of fish in the tank down really helps.

What I did was kept extra aquarium water in the refrigerator and
replaced aquarium water with the chilled water. Fill up a jug of
aquarium water and put in fridge, and take a chilled one out and dump it
in the aquarium. I was able to keep my temp at decent level doing
this twice a day. Plus a fan on the aquarium also helps. Not the best
way to do it, but it is a lot cheaper than buying a chiller unit.

"Velvet" wrote in message
...
Geoff Kemp wrote:
Hi,

Given the recent warm weather in the SE of the UK (north essex), I`ve
been
having a few problems keeping a constant temperature in my 65 litre
tank.
It is kept in a west facing room, and in the evening it get very warm,
given
the amount of insulation in the house. I`ve noticed a different in
temperature ranging from 25 (first thing in the morning) up to around 29
(early evening /later afternoon). I have had two confimred casuities,
and
possibly two more. To which end I have checked my parameters and these
seem
stable (ph 7.6, kh 15dkh, GH 16 dkh, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 10, NH4 0).

I can get a fan to move the air around the tank, however this will be
about
2 metres away. I also work shifts, so on some days during the warmest
part,
I may not be here to make any water changes during the warmest part of
the
day (note however I *do* carry out my regualr water changes,
approximatly
every 6 days).

I would be able to place a standard Fan closer to the aquarium, that was
an
option, as I could pick one up quite easily and cheaply, have it a lot
closer.

Any other suggestions ??

Thanks in advance,

Geoff



I'd say that you might want to look at upping the general temp of the
tank by a couple of degrees on a permanent basis (gradually) thus
lessening the daily swing of the temp.

I have a community tank, and even in the height of summer last year had
no deaths, with the tank regularly at 31-33C during the day (in a room
that faces both south-east and north-west - double aspect). The tank
gets no direct sunlight.

Of late, it's been sat at around that temp off and on (faulty heaterstat
gradually getting worse) and again no fatalities.

I have a well planted (well, it was until the latest bout of high temps
in it, coupled with a frisky pair of breeding angelfish) tank which I
think helps keep the O2 levels up in the water in the heat too.

Keep the curtains closed on that room to help stop the temp buildup in
the first place, bubble extra air through the tank. What others have
said about the air blowing across the top is right, that's the best way
to achieve cooling, but you'll also have to keep up the water changes to
stop excessive loss through evap, and also reduce the minerals etc left
behind.

If you can get extra air vents in the hood then do that, think about
maybe reducing the lights that are on at peak temp time.

Fish should be fairly resilient if they're common-or-garden(ish)
tropicals, as long as you let them get used to the higher temp
gradually, which is why I suggested upping the temp by 2C of the tank as
a base line for it.

Am presuming you don't have ammonia present in the tank, I can't
remember if ammonia gets more nasty at a higher temp or not, it's been a
while since I've had to worry about that in mine.

--


Velvet

If you are pretty clever with plumbing, you may be able to set up a sump in
a cooler part of the house and set up a continuous pumped loop. That's
probably overkill though.

How is the tank heating up? If it is direct solar radiation, blackout
curtains or even heavy curtains will help quite a bit. If the whole room is
heating up, then open a door to the rest of the house and turn on a fan to
circulate the air with the rest of the house. If your windows are open, and
the whole house is heating up to the 30's, then I bet your only option is to
raise the tank temperature on a seasonal basis as mentioned before.

HTH
Joe

"Chuck" wrote in message
. ..
What I did was kept extra aquarium water in the refrigerator and
replaced aquarium water with the chilled water. Fill up a jug of
aquarium water and put in fridge, and take a chilled one out and dump it
in the aquarium. I was able to keep my temp at decent level doing
this twice a day.

This is probably the worse thing you can do. In the wild the
ponds the fish live in can reach very high temperatures during
the day and surprisingly low temperatures at night. The fish
survive because the change is gradual. The thing that stresses
them and can cause death is a sudden change.

Like dumping chilled water in the tank :-)

--
Edward Cowling - London - UK