Having steep sides on a pond?

Hi,

I'm in the process of building a pond and am currently digging the
hole. A side view of what I have dug is below (I hope the formatting
is comes out OK):

| |
| |
|________ |
| |
| |
|________|

So basically, it's 2 metres/8 feet wide, 2 metres/8 feet long, half at
a depth of 0.8 metres/2.5 feet and the other half with a depth of 0.4
metres/1.2 feet. The pond's edges are dug at roughly an 80 degree
angle.

My questions:

1. Will the steep sides be a problem and cause too much pressure on
the pond liner? The sides are a sandy/soily material while the bottom
of both the shallow and deep ends are sandstone. I'm planning to get
the Firestone 45mil pond liner.

2. With the bottom of the pond being sandstone, will this cause any
problems? How thick a layer of sand would you recommend lining the
hole with before putting in the pond liner?

Thanks in advance,

Han.

I have similar soil, and I used just about as steep as sides on my lily
pond dug to 2 feet. This was built in 2000, so far all is A-okay, I also
used 45 mil EPDM. If the sandstone is smooth, the liner should be okay, but
I'll let someone more familiar with sandstone answer for sure. ~ jan

See my ponds thru the seasons and/or my filter design:
http://users.owt.com/jjspond/

~Keep 'em Defrosted~
Tri-Cities, WA Zone 7a
To e-mail see website

On 28 Dec 2003 12:56:18 -0800, (Han Chung) wrote:

Hi,

I'm in the process of building a pond and am currently digging the
hole. A side view of what I have dug is below (I hope the formatting
is comes out OK):

| |
| |
|________ |
| |
| |
|________|

So basically, it's 2 metres/8 feet wide, 2 metres/8 feet long, half at
a depth of 0.8 metres/2.5 feet and the other half with a depth of 0.4
metres/1.2 feet. The pond's edges are dug at roughly an 80 degree
angle.

My questions:

1. Will the steep sides be a problem and cause too much pressure on
the pond liner? The sides are a sandy/soily material while the bottom
of both the shallow and deep ends are sandstone. I'm planning to get
the Firestone 45mil pond liner.

2. With the bottom of the pond being sandstone, will this cause any
problems? How thick a layer of sand would you recommend lining the
hole with before putting in the pond liner?

Thanks in advance,

Han.

I'm still new to this pond thing myself, but I can tell you for sure, the angle
of the sides have nothing to do with the pressure they'll experience, unless
you're talking about a dam, not a hole, in which case you're concerned about the
thickness of the dam. But even then, the pressure is still the same, regardless
of the angle.

Also, FWIW, one meter is equal to about 6 1/2 feet. One meter = 39.37 inches.

"Han Chung" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I'm in the process of building a pond and am currently digging the
hole. A side view of what I have dug is below (I hope the formatting
is comes out OK):

| |
| |
|________ |
| |
| |
|________|

So basically, it's 2 metres/8 feet wide, 2 metres/8 feet long, half at
a depth of 0.8 metres/2.5 feet and the other half with a depth of 0.4
metres/1.2 feet. The pond's edges are dug at roughly an 80 degree
angle.

My questions:

1. Will the steep sides be a problem and cause too much pressure on
the pond liner? The sides are a sandy/soily material while the bottom
of both the shallow and deep ends are sandstone. I'm planning to get
the Firestone 45mil pond liner.

2. With the bottom of the pond being sandstone, will this cause any
problems? How thick a layer of sand would you recommend lining the
hole with before putting in the pond liner?

Thanks in advance,

Han.

On 28 Dec 2003 12:56:18 -0800, (Han Chung)
wrote:

Hi,

I'm in the process of building a pond and am currently digging the
hole. A side view of what I have dug is below (I hope the formatting
is comes out OK):

| |
| |
|________ |
| |
| |
|________|

So basically, it's 2 metres/8 feet wide, 2 metres/8 feet long, half at
a depth of 0.8 metres/2.5 feet and the other half with a depth of 0.4
metres/1.2 feet. The pond's edges are dug at roughly an 80 degree
angle.

My questions:

1. Will the steep sides be a problem and cause too much pressure on
the pond liner? The sides are a sandy/soily material while the bottom
of both the shallow and deep ends are sandstone. I'm planning to get
the Firestone 45mil pond liner.

The side slope has nothing to do with pressure. Pressure comes from
water depth only. If your soil is very sandy (as mine is) you may
want to provide a means to keep it in place. Without some retainer it
might slide to the bottom reaching an equilibrium state of 1:3 slope.

I put concrete block in mine to get vertical sides, with a cross
section that is similar to yours. I put rerod through the holes of
the block to keep them in place until the wate went in. Then I
covered them with protective cloth to keep the liner off the rough
edges. Worked great.


2. With the bottom of the pond being sandstone, will this cause any
problems? How thick a layer of sand would you recommend lining the
hole with before putting in the pond liner?

I would put 2 - 3 inches of sand minimum to make sure that the liner
never contacts the sandstone. However, if you use the protective
material that I described above you can just line the whole thing with
it. That is what I did and I put two layers to make sure.

See my pond and screen at www.anatekcorp.com/garden/pondscreen.htm

John

"Han Chung" wrote in message
om...
Hi,

I'm in the process of building a pond and am currently digging the
hole. A side view of what I have dug is below (I hope the formatting
is comes out OK):

| |
| |
|________ |
| |
| |
|________|

So basically, it's 2 metres/8 feet wide, 2 metres/8 feet long, half at
a depth of 0.8 metres/2.5 feet and the other half with a depth of 0.4
metres/1.2 feet. The pond's edges are dug at roughly an 80 degree
angle.

My questions:

1. Will the steep sides be a problem
snip

I have very steep sides on one side of my pond and on the other I have a
gentle slope. The look is very nice, but maintenance is awful. There is NO
easy way in and out of my pond, and forget about sitting planting baskets
flat.

If I did it all again, I'd have shelves, nice and flat ones.

BV.
www.iheartmypond.com

John Bachman wrote in message . ..
I would put 2 - 3 inches of sand minimum to make sure that the liner
never contacts the sandstone. However, if you use the protective
material that I described above you can just line the whole thing with
it. That is what I did and I put two layers to make sure.

How would I go about lining the steep edges with sand?

Han.

On 29 Dec 2003 12:42:15 -0800, (Han Chung)
wrote:

John Bachman wrote in message . ..
I would put 2 - 3 inches of sand minimum to make sure that the liner
never contacts the sandstone. However, if you use the protective
material that I described above you can just line the whole thing with
it. That is what I did and I put two layers to make sure.

How would I go about lining the steep edges with sand?

I do not know a way to do that. That is one reason why I used the
liner protector material. It worked really well. I put it under my
stream from my waterfall also. That way I can put large rocks in the
stream with no danger of punching through the EPDM.

John

On Tue, 30 Dec 2003 06:52:11 -0500
John Bachman wrote:

On 29 Dec 2003 12:42:15 -0800, (Han Chung)
wrote:

John Bachman wrote in message
... I would put 2 -
3 inches of sand minimum to make sure that the liner never contacts
the sandstone. However, if you use the protective material that I
described above you can just line the whole thing with it. That is
what I did and I put two layers to make sure.

How would I go about lining the steep edges with sand?

I do not know a way to do that. That is one reason why I used the
liner protector material. It worked really well. I put it under my
stream from my waterfall also. That way I can put large rocks in the
stream with no danger of punching through the EPDM.

John

A method of lining the steep sides with 'sand' is to mix the sand with a
goodly portion of mason's lime. This will make a good sticky mixture
that can be painted or troweled onto the (moistened) sides. I did this
for my backyard pond somewhere around eight years ago. I last year had
a disaster in that pond and had to rebuild it. The under liner
sand/lime mix was pristine, clean, and almost concrete-like except that
it was quite a bit softer.
When mixing just make sure that the mix will stand out horizontally from
a trowel about 2 inches. It's very easy to work with, but definitely
use gloves as the lime is caustic.

Cybe R. Wizard
--
Unofficial "Wizard of Odds," A.H.P.
Original PORG "Water Wizard," R.P.
"Wize(ned) Wizard," A.P.F-P-Y.
Barely Tolerated Wizard, A.J.L & A.A.L

I too built a pond in sand and had to remove the whole thing and go with concrete
blocks http://puregold.aquaria.net/hopepond/page1/pp1.htm
the second, smaller pond I used wood and studs
http://puregold.aquaria.net/mypond/2000/p2000.htm
when using blocks, I used aluminum conduit and filled the blocks and packed the
sand/dirt in them. one of the ponds is only 3 feet deep, but there is a wide shelf
18 inches, the other pond is 5 feet deep and there are wide shelves on both sides.
my newest pond is 4 feet deep and there is a single step to get into the pond.
I tried "rug" and tossed that after the first disaster and went with foam padding
like used for carpets. it is cheap, it doesnt degrade. even now when I step into my
pond built 10 years ago if feel the foam cushioning.
forget the sand. use foam padding.
Ingrid

(Han Chung) wrote:
1. Will the steep sides be a problem and cause too much pressure on
the pond liner? The sides are a sandy/soily material while the bottom
of both the shallow and deep ends are sandstone. I'm planning to get
the Firestone 45mil pond liner.

2. With the bottom of the pond being sandstone, will this cause any
problems? How thick a layer of sand would you recommend lining the
hole with before putting in the pond liner?


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