Power filter for 20 gallon tank?

After being out of the hobby for 20 years I plan to set up a 20 gallon
freshwater tropical aquarium soon. I am an experienced aquarist, having
been in the hobby for 20 years.
For ten years I worked at Ed's Tropical Aquarium, a pet store in
Lynbrook, New York.

I want to keep it simple, and easy enough for my 10 year old daughter
Elizabeth
to help maintain. I plan on using an UGF with powerhead, and a power
filter.
Sadly gone now is my favorite line, the Supreme Aquamasters, made right
here
on Long Island. So I guess I am stuck with the more modern cartridge
models.

Can any of them use bulk floss, carbon, and other inexpensive filter
media?

And which brands are quietest? We sold Whisper, Hagen, and Marineland,
all of which buzzed loudly. Are the TetraTec or Eheim Liberty models
quiet?

Recommendations, please...

TIA,
Christopher Platt

wrote in message
oups.com...
After being out of the hobby for 20 years I plan to set up a 20 gallon
freshwater tropical aquarium soon. I am an experienced aquarist, having
been in the hobby for 20 years.
For ten years I worked at Ed's Tropical Aquarium, a pet store in
Lynbrook, New York.

Then you must also know FishTown USA in Queens. I believe it was on
Northern Blvd, not far from Francis Lewis Blvd.


I want to keep it simple, and easy enough for my 10 year old daughter
Elizabeth
to help maintain. I plan on using an UGF with powerhead, and a power
filter.

UGFs have fallen out of favor with many people. It's too hard to remove the
mulm that collects under them. Some people say plants don't do well over
them either.

Sadly gone now is my favorite line, the Supreme Aquamasters, made right
here
on Long Island. So I guess I am stuck with the more modern cartridge
models.

I wouldn't touch a cartridge model. I use Aquaclears which use sponges and
small bags of bio-beads. You just rinse them off and reuse. I have ACs
still running since 1987 or 88. They're not expensive and they're real
workhorses.

Can any of them use bulk floss, carbon, and other inexpensive filter
media?

Look at the Aquaclears (ACs).

And which brands are quietest? We sold Whisper, Hagen, and Marineland,
all of which buzzed loudly. Are the TetraTec or Eheim Liberty models
quiet?

All but one of my ACs are dead silent.

--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*

Undergravel filters have fallen out of favor you say? Surprising if
true.
They always worked very well for me - if used in conjunction with a
power filter.
Typically UGF filters only failed for my customers who mistakenly
relied on them
as their sole means of filtration.

I never experienced a mulm buildup, even in long-established tanks,
with and
without plants. My only negative experience with an UGF was when I
tried a
reverse-flow setup - the fish seemed stressed by the constant upward
current.

Chris

wrote in message
oups.com...
Undergravel filters have fallen out of favor you say? Surprising if
true.
They always worked very well for me - if used in conjunction with a
power filter.

Then go for it. :-) No one I know uses them anymore.

Typically UGF filters only failed for my customers who mistakenly
relied on them
as their sole means of filtration.

Failure wasn't the problem. Getting the crud out from under them was.
Also, some people like live plants and claim they don't do well with an
UGF.

I never experienced a mulm buildup, even in long-established tanks,
with and
without plants.

Really? Where did the mulm go that was sucked into and under the gravel?

My only negative experience with an UGF was when I
tried a
reverse-flow setup - the fish seemed stressed by the constant upward
current.

Chris

--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*

Köi-Lö $##$$@$##$$.#$$ wrote in news:4507665d$0$15906
:

Also, some people like live plants and claim they don't do well with an
UGF.

They do fine. As much as I dislike UGFs, we use them at work because
they're dirt cheap and you never have to replace any part of it. My own
tank at work runs on one and probably has more plant material in it now
than water.

The real issue is the UGF is very hard to clean without disturbing your
plants. This is less of an issue if your UGF is not your primary filter.



Really? Where did the mulm go that was sucked into and under the gravel?

Most of the mulm remains trapped in the gravel; what passes under the plate
is generally pulled out by the powerhead and blasted back into the tank--
eventually settling back into the gravel. After an extended amount of time
(years) some significant material does build-up under the plate, but it is
usually easily pulled back out of the plate through normal gravel
siphoning.

I suppose if one used airstones intead of a powerhead mulm deposits beneath
the plate would be more of a problem.

Again... not a fan of the UGF myself. I do not use them away from work.
They are too much of a hassle than they are worth IMHO.

"dc" wrote in message
...
Köi-Lö $##$$@$##$$.#$$ wrote in news:4507665d$0$15906
:

Also, some people like live plants and claim they don't do well with an
UGF.

They do fine. As much as I dislike UGFs, we use them at work because
they're dirt cheap and you never have to replace any part of it.

The powerheads to run them needed replacement about every 18 months.

My own
tank at work runs on one and probably has more plant material in it now
than water.

I had no problem with plants and UGFs either but then I have really tough
plants. ;-)

The real issue is the UGF is very hard to clean without disturbing your
plants. This is less of an issue if your UGF is not your primary filter.

It wasn't my primary filter and still mulm would collect under the plates.

Really? Where did the mulm go that was sucked into and under the gravel?

Most of the mulm remains trapped in the gravel; what passes under the
plate
is generally pulled out by the powerhead and blasted back into the tank--
eventually settling back into the gravel.

In my tanks there would be a collection of mulm on the tank bottom. You
could see it by looking up at the tank's bottom. My stands don't have solid
tops.

After an extended amount of time
(years) some significant material does build-up under the plate, but it is
usually easily pulled back out of the plate through normal gravel
siphoning.

The gravel vac didn't have enough suction to pull it up through the plates
and gravel. I would shimmy a hose down the uplift tubes and squiggle it
around trying to suck up as much mulm as possible..... one day I said to
hell with this and removed them altogether as my friends were doing.

I suppose if one used airstones intead of a powerhead mulm deposits
beneath
the plate would be more of a problem.

I used both. Powerheads on the 30L and both 55gs and airstones on the 10s.
All the UGFs are now stored in the outbuilding. :-)

Again... not a fan of the UGF myself. I do not use them away from work.
They are too much of a hassle than they are worth IMHO.

I agree.
--
KL....
Frugal ponding since 1995.
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~~ }((((* ~~~ }{{{{(ö ~~~~ }((((({*

Again... not a fan of the UGF myself. I do not use them away from work.
They are too much of a hassle than they are worth IMHO.

rodger that.
would rather use an airpowered sponge filter or fbf meself.
too many tanks to clean to stuff around pulling out plates!

wrote:
After being out of the hobby for 20 years I plan to set up a 20 gallon
freshwater tropical aquarium soon. I am an experienced aquarist, having
been in the hobby for 20 years.
For ten years I worked at Ed's Tropical Aquarium, a pet store in
Lynbrook, New York.

I want to keep it simple, and easy enough for my 10 year old daughter
Elizabeth
to help maintain. I plan on using an UGF with powerhead, and a power
filter.
Sadly gone now is my favorite line, the Supreme Aquamasters, made right
here
on Long Island. So I guess I am stuck with the more modern cartridge
models.

Can any of them use bulk floss, carbon, and other inexpensive filter
media?

And which brands are quietest? We sold Whisper, Hagen, and Marineland,
all of which buzzed loudly. Are the TetraTec or Eheim Liberty models
quiet?

Recommendations, please...

TIA,
Christopher Platt

Hi Christopher.
Being out of the hobby for 20 yrs, we've come along way.
Forget about the UGF. Much, much better options out there now a days
and an UGF is just a cess pool waiting to happen.
Go with a power filter (HOB..hang on back). I like the ones that have
both the filter pad for catching debris and a Bio Wheel.
The Bio Wheel is simply a place for the nirtifying bacteria to grow in
large numbers.
You spoke of Wisper, Hagen and Marineland filters as "buzzing loudly"?
I'm confused. The filters buzzed? If they made any sort of buzzing they
weren't running properly or the water level wasn't correct.
Now if you were talking about pumps, I can see those buzzing, but you
won't need any pumps making any noises with a HOB filter.
That right there was a huge plus for the hobby.
Also, being out for 20 yrs...they have Pythons now. They hook up to the
faucet, flip a switch and it drains the tank for you while you vacuum
the gravel. Go back to the faucet, adjust the temp to closest to the
tank water, add dechlor directly to the tank, flip the switch and
you're then refilling the tank.
No more buckets. Yippy, yea, yahoooooo!
Now for cycling, find yourself a shop that sells Bio Spira.
This is the one bacteria starter that contains the correct bacteria in
it and will cyle a tank in 24 hours, and then it's ready for full
stocking!
None of the other ones work, such as Cycle, Stress Zyme, Bio Zyme, etc.
They all have the wrong bacteria in them and don't help the start up
bacteria.
They can get away with claiming it does because they contain a later
stage bacteria....however that doesn't help a brand new set up at all.
I think they should be taken off the market because they're lying to
unknowledgeable hobbyists. Too shady.

I helped maintain 100+ tanks at the store, and experience taught me
that
the key to maintaining a healthy aquarium is frequent partial water
changes.
No filter or chemical can replace this.

At home I changed 10% per week religiously, stirring up the gravel
so the power filter could remove some of the detritus. My fish
thrived.

When I had several tanks I used a diatom filter to "polish" the water,
sometimes boosted with a clearing aid (flocculent) like Acurel F.

Another thing working in the store taught me is to be wary of
advertising
and salesmen's claims...

"Excelsior, you fathead!"
-Chris-

wrote:
I helped maintain 100+ tanks at the store, and experience taught me
that
the key to maintaining a healthy aquarium is frequent partial water
changes.
No filter or chemical can replace this.

At home I changed 10% per week religiously, stirring up the gravel
so the power filter could remove some of the detritus. My fish
thrived.

When I had several tanks I used a diatom filter to "polish" the water,
sometimes boosted with a clearing aid (flocculent) like Acurel F.

Another thing working in the store taught me is to be wary of
advertising
and salesmen's claims...

"Excelsior, you fathead!"
-Chris-

Chris...
You never answered my questions about what the "buzzing" noises.
Were they coming from the actual filter?
Was it a pump?
Are you going to choose a HOB filter, etc?
Oh.... absolutely water changes should be done weekly, but you were
speaking of filters.
And was the "salemen's" comment towards me, or just a general comment?
If it was towards me, I can assure you I am no sales person.
Just another hobbyist who's been in it seriously for many years.