betta salt non iodide

On Sat, 4 Mar 2006 11:29:44 -0500, "Nikki"
wrote:

Well I was asking also because these are the fish I got when I got the
guppies from my LFS, they all had ick,

I can't believe they accepted money for icky fish.

which may not of been smart to buy
them, but they are closing,

Forever, I hope?

-- Mister Gardener

Yes they are closing forever...she says not enough business..wonder why
I don't make a habit of buying fish there, when my five year old wanted a
fish for the first time we went there, a half hour after getting the fish it
died, my husband took him down again to get a new one, my husband has always
had tanks so he looked around and said NO she has to many dead fish floating
around in the tanks, but our son said please, so he got him another since it
was not going in a tank with other fish it was not a big deal, it died also
the same day, so I usually only get supplies there, I just happened to see
the guppies and bettas and felt bad, that was my own fault. FWIW, I never
had betta's before and I got them 2, and although they are a bit beat up, I
really like them, they are pretty and neat to watch, I hope they make it
through. Got rid of ick on them, they are missing a lot of fins I would say
one is missing about 30% of fins and the other is missing about 40-50%, but
they are not acting sick, they are eating and swimming so I will see what
happens. I was wondering about the salt because I read that when they are
missing fins they are prone to get fungus or bacteria infections and since
they had ick, I thought if they liked salt it may prevent any of those
problems from happening
Nikki



"Mr. Gardener" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 4 Mar 2006 11:29:44 -0500, "Nikki"
wrote:

Well I was asking also because these are the fish I got when I got the
guppies from my LFS, they all had ick,

I can't believe they accepted money for icky fish.

which may not of been smart to buy
them, but they are closing,

Forever, I hope?

-- Mister Gardener

Nikki wrote:
Yes they are closing forever...she says not enough business..wonder why
I don't make a habit of buying fish there, when my five year old wanted a
fish for the first time we went there, a half hour after getting the fish it
died, my husband took him down again to get a new one, my husband has always
had tanks so he looked around and said NO she has to many dead fish floating
around in the tanks, but our son said please, so he got him another since it
was not going in a tank with other fish it was not a big deal, it died also
the same day, so I usually only get supplies there, I just happened to see
the guppies and bettas and felt bad, that was my own fault. FWIW, I never
had betta's before and I got them 2, and although they are a bit beat up, I
really like them, they are pretty and neat to watch, I hope they make it
through. Got rid of ick on them, they are missing a lot of fins I would say
one is missing about 30% of fins and the other is missing about 40-50%, but
they are not acting sick, they are eating and swimming so I will see what
happens. I was wondering about the salt because I read that when they are
missing fins they are prone to get fungus or bacteria infections and since
they had ick, I thought if they liked salt it may prevent any of those
problems from happening

Eating and swimming is naturally a good sign, as is the cleared ich.
I'm going to risk sounding like a broken record. ;-) The best thing
for fin damage is very clean water. A touch of salt makes sense too,
but only while they're recovering. Then I'd wean them to fresh water.

If your betta gets bacteria on the fins, go back to your Q-tip with the
peroxide. A Q-tip with malachite green is a great cure for fungus. I
also find that feeding twice a day rather than once gives bettas the
nutrition they need to regrow fins.

In general, bettas heal from fin damage very well. I think it's because
they evolved fighting and healing.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

I am going to have to go to the mall, its a distance but that is the closest
pet store now, I am guessing I can just ask someone there about the stuff
you said. I have been changing the water every day, since they are in a
tank, I have a filter and heater, I don't know if I should do a full or
partial water change every day? I been doing about 50%, My ick med says Ick+
fungus and bacteria, is that true? does it work for the fungus and bacteria?
I am not sure but I thought someone said betta's don't like salt at all,
then I read somewhere they do, is Morton's non-iodized salt ok or should I
go get another kind? how much should I use while they are getting better?
again thanks
Nikki




"Altum" wrote in message
. net...
Nikki wrote:
Yes they are closing forever...she says not enough business..wonder why
I don't make a habit of buying fish there, when my five year old wanted a
fish for the first time we went there, a half hour after getting the fish
it died, my husband took him down again to get a new one, my husband has
always had tanks so he looked around and said NO she has to many dead
fish floating around in the tanks, but our son said please, so he got him
another since it was not going in a tank with other fish it was not a big
deal, it died also the same day, so I usually only get supplies there, I
just happened to see the guppies and bettas and felt bad, that was my own
fault. FWIW, I never had betta's before and I got them 2, and although
they are a bit beat up, I really like them, they are pretty and neat to
watch, I hope they make it through. Got rid of ick on them, they are
missing a lot of fins I would say one is missing about 30% of fins and
the other is missing about 40-50%, but they are not acting sick, they are
eating and swimming so I will see what happens. I was wondering about the
salt because I read that when they are missing fins they are prone to get
fungus or bacteria infections and since they had ick, I thought if they
liked salt it may prevent any of those problems from happening

Eating and swimming is naturally a good sign, as is the cleared ich. I'm
going to risk sounding like a broken record. ;-) The best thing for fin
damage is very clean water. A touch of salt makes sense too, but only
while they're recovering. Then I'd wean them to fresh water.

If your betta gets bacteria on the fins, go back to your Q-tip with the
peroxide. A Q-tip with malachite green is a great cure for fungus. I
also find that feeding twice a day rather than once gives bettas the
nutrition they need to regrow fins.

In general, bettas heal from fin damage very well. I think it's because
they evolved fighting and healing.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

Nikki wrote:
I am going to have to go to the mall, its a distance but that is the closest
pet store now, I am guessing I can just ask someone there about the stuff
you said. I have been changing the water every day, since they are in a
tank, I have a filter and heater, I don't know if I should do a full or
partial water change every day? I been doing about 50%, My ick med says Ick+
fungus and bacteria, is that true? does it work for the fungus and bacteria?
I am not sure but I thought someone said betta's don't like salt at all,
then I read somewhere they do, is Morton's non-iodized salt ok or should I
go get another kind? how much should I use while they are getting better?
again thanks
Nikki

50% water changes a day is great! There is no need to change more - you
might start stressing the fish. Rid-Ich+ is a formalin/malachite green
medication. It's a very good treatment for ich, velvet, and other
protozoans. It will help prevent fungus and bacteria, but I wouldn't
use it to cure an active infection of either.

Your bettas had ich, not fungus or bacteria, so you need an ich
medicine. Don't worry too much about bacteria and fungus. The water
changes will take care of that part. Water changes are the best cure
for fin damage.

Bettas don't like salt or even hard water. They are soft water fish.
However, as you know, fungus and bacteria don't either. There is a
trade-off between stressing your fish and getting the benefits of salt.
Rid-Ich+ stresses fish too so you shouldn't mix Rid-Ich+ and salt.
(Fish like guppies don't mind it and benefit from the salt.)

If you want specific directions, Here's what I would do. Keep doing the
water changes until you see some new growth on the fins. It should take
about a week - two at the outside. Then you can slow down to twice
weekly water changes because the fins are much less likely to get
infected. For the next two weeks, add one dose of Rid-Ich+ every third
day. That will kill any ich parasites in the tanks and help prevent
fungus or bacteria. I very much doubt you will see fungus or bacteria,
but if you do, dab a Q-tip with some peroxide on the infected fin. As
you know, peroxide will burn gills badly so be careful not to get any on
the gills. I would not use any salt because of the Rid-Ich+.

For future reference and for the guppies, the Morton's salt is fine.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

Thank you, that is what i needed to know, specific directions, that gives me
the direction i needed, i just have one quick question, I did explain in
another post just a few minutes ago, but i dont know if you read it, so i
will sum it up quick here,
My Betta's are in a 3 or 5 gallon (not sure what size) looks about three,
with a divider, filter, heater, i have the heat on 80, with the rid ick+ it
says if i rememer right you should do water changes before using another
dose. how much should you change after using ick med is 50% ok? i was also
wondering if i should take the rocks out? I have a sandman filter in their
tank, not set up with sand and all.... just got some floss in it to catch
anything going through, it was the only filter i had that would fit on that
tank.
Again thank you so much for your help.
Do you happen to know how much salt goes in the guppy tank, and it wont kill
them since i have never had salt in it before will it? Is it also good for
the babies?
Nikki





50% water changes a day is great! There is no need to change more - you
might start stressing the fish. Rid-Ich+ is a formalin/malachite green
medication. It's a very good treatment for ich, velvet, and other
protozoans. It will help prevent fungus and bacteria, but I wouldn't use
it to cure an active infection of either.

Your bettas had ich, not fungus or bacteria, so you need an ich medicine.
Don't worry too much about bacteria and fungus. The water changes will
take care of that part. Water changes are the best cure for fin damage.

Bettas don't like salt or even hard water. They are soft water fish.
However, as you know, fungus and bacteria don't either. There is a
trade-off between stressing your fish and getting the benefits of salt.
Rid-Ich+ stresses fish too so you shouldn't mix Rid-Ich+ and salt. (Fish
like guppies don't mind it and benefit from the salt.)

If you want specific directions, Here's what I would do. Keep doing the
water changes until you see some new growth on the fins. It should take
about a week - two at the outside. Then you can slow down to twice weekly
water changes because the fins are much less likely to get infected. For
the next two weeks, add one dose of Rid-Ich+ every third day. That will
kill any ich parasites in the tanks and help prevent fungus or bacteria.
I very much doubt you will see fungus or bacteria, but if you do, dab a
Q-tip with some peroxide on the infected fin. As you know, peroxide will
burn gills badly so be careful not to get any on the gills. I would not
use any salt because of the Rid-Ich+.

For future reference and for the guppies, the Morton's salt is fine.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

In article ,
Altum wrote:
50% water changes a day is great! There is no need to change more - you
might start stressing the fish.

No it won't.


--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

"Richard Sexton" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Altum wrote:
50% water changes a day is great! There is no need to change more - you
might start stressing the fish.

No it won't.


Well.... maybe you guys should add some qualifiers. If your tap water is
_suitable_, then you can work your way _up_ to 100% water changes as often
as you like.

In regards to 'suitability', well water for example, is rarely suitable for
such large water changes without first being air'ed out. If I go above 20%,
my fish do not look happy. Also my well water varies by season, and during
the middle of winter, it's far too hard (gH) to use raw. I'm sure there is
_some_ variation in everyone's water supply, hopefully very little, but a
good thing to check and know.

In regards to the amount & frequency of the change, it depends on the
difference between source & destination. If your tank's have been getting
20% weekly historically, then the source water (your tap) will probably be
softer (gH) and have far lower DOCs. Initially you would want to start
increasing your water changes to make your destination water more similar to
your source (so the fish are exposed to less of a change). For your
average set-up, it would take a couple of weeks to get to 50% changes, and a
month to get to 100% changes (I'm using 100% to indicate as much as you
practically can change in your set-up). At 100%, your source and
destination water should be nearly identical, so the amount/frequency of the
changes are just keeping it that way.

Source water is rarely suitable for huge water changes, unless you're very
lucky (ie: you pump, UV and in-line heat your own river water), or you do
some in-line processing of municipal/well water (ie: carbon or dose de-chlor
for chlorine/chloramines, zeolite for ammonia, iron filter might outgas it,
storage tanks as needed, in-line heating etc).

This is my limited understanding of the topic ), and yes, I hope to retire
living by a river ;~).
--
www.NetMax.tk

--
Need Mercedes parts ? - http://parts.mbz.org
Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org
1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home page: http://rs79.vrx.net
633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net

On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 16:31:01 -0500, "Nikki"
wrote:

Yes they are closing forever...she says not enough business..wonder why
I don't make a habit of buying fish there, when my five year old wanted a
fish for the first time we went there, a half hour after getting the fish it
died, my husband took him down again to get a new one, my husband has always
had tanks so he looked around and said NO she has to many dead fish floating
around in the tanks, but our son said please, so he got him another since it
was not going in a tank with other fish it was not a big deal, it died also
the same day, so I usually only get supplies there, I just happened to see
the guppies and bettas and felt bad, that was my own fault. FWIW, I never
had betta's before and I got them 2, and although they are a bit beat up, I
really like them, they are pretty and neat to watch, I hope they make it
through. Got rid of ick on them, they are missing a lot of fins I would say
one is missing about 30% of fins and the other is missing about 40-50%, but
they are not acting sick, they are eating and swimming so I will see what
happens. I was wondering about the salt because I read that when they are
missing fins they are prone to get fungus or bacteria infections and since
they had ick, I thought if they liked salt it may prevent any of those
problems from happening
Nikki

These bettas might be good candidates for a full Metafix or Pimafix
program, I forget which does which, maybe both would be good.
This stuff is pretty new to me, so I'll toss it out here. Anybody?

-- Mister Gardener

Mr. Gardener wrote:
On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 16:31:01 -0500, "Nikki"
wrote:


Yes they are closing forever...she says not enough business..wonder why
I don't make a habit of buying fish there, when my five year old wanted a
fish for the first time we went there, a half hour after getting the fish it
died, my husband took him down again to get a new one, my husband has always
had tanks so he looked around and said NO she has to many dead fish floating
around in the tanks, but our son said please, so he got him another since it
was not going in a tank with other fish it was not a big deal, it died also
the same day, so I usually only get supplies there, I just happened to see
the guppies and bettas and felt bad, that was my own fault. FWIW, I never
had betta's before and I got them 2, and although they are a bit beat up, I
really like them, they are pretty and neat to watch, I hope they make it
through. Got rid of ick on them, they are missing a lot of fins I would say
one is missing about 30% of fins and the other is missing about 40-50%, but
they are not acting sick, they are eating and swimming so I will see what
happens. I was wondering about the salt because I read that when they are
missing fins they are prone to get fungus or bacteria infections and since
they had ick, I thought if they liked salt it may prevent any of those
problems from happening
Nikki


These bettas might be good candidates for a full Metafix or Pimafix
program, I forget which does which, maybe both would be good.
This stuff is pretty new to me, so I'll toss it out here. Anybody?

-- Mister Gardener

Scrambles to the back of the tank cabinet for dusty meds.....

Melafix would be for the repair of the damanged fins, Pimafix would be
for fungal infections - if you decide to use them I wouldn't use them
together.

If the Ick is clear, personally, I would go for a lot of water changes.
Some people change up to 100% in their small betta tanks - but I
wouldn't necessarily suggest it right now. I would do around 30% twice
daily or 50% daily until things clear up. With good quality, clean water
the bettas should regrow their "ploomage" (fins and tails)if the damage
is superficial. If the wounds are obviously infected then some salt
might help as well but I wouldn't use salt long term in a betta tank if
they are healthy.


Gill