Activated carbon reactor

Other than hanging a bag filled with carbon in the sump,
what do you use to make carbon work more efficiently?

Tha idea with a bag works, but in my understanding
water would penetrate carbon better if it was flowing
forced through not around the bag...

I was trying to put a layer of carbon in the phosphate
reactor, but carbon is very light and it is easily
lifted up with water and travels back to my tank...

How do you put carbon to work in your reef tanks?

I've never been a big user of carbon, but at the
store, I used it a lot because you never know what
people are throwing in the tanks. I just used it in
the bag method, usually in a high flow area You can
leave it in a bag, and place it that way in your
reactor so that water is forced through it.
Panty-hose works real well in that it can be used to
conform to any spaces.

Wayne Sallee


Pszemol wrote on 9/15/2007 11:41 AM:
Other than hanging a bag filled with carbon in the sump,
what do you use to make carbon work more efficiently?

Tha idea with a bag works, but in my understanding
water would penetrate carbon better if it was flowing
forced through not around the bag...

I was trying to put a layer of carbon in the phosphate
reactor, but carbon is very light and it is easily
lifted up with water and travels back to my tank...

How do you put carbon to work in your reef tanks?

On Sep 15, 10:55 am, Wayne Sallee wrote:
I've never been a big user of carbon, but at the
store, I used it a lot because you never know what
people are throwing in the tanks. I just used it in
the bag method, usually in a high flow area You can
leave it in a bag, and place it that way in your
reactor so that water is forced through it.
Panty-hose works real well in that it can be used to
conform to any spaces.

Wayne Sallee


Pszemol wrote on 9/15/2007 11:41 AM:



Other than hanging a bag filled with carbon in the sump,
what do you use to make carbon work more efficiently?

Tha idea with a bag works, but in my understanding
water would penetrate carbon better if it was flowing
forced through not around the bag...

I was trying to put a layer of carbon in the phosphate
reactor, but carbon is very light and it is easily
lifted up with water and travels back to my tank...

How do you put carbon to work in your reef tanks?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Why use carbon and remove beneficial stuff as well as junk. Carbon in
most cases is not needed, and a water change is more beneficial
overall.

"TSJ" wrote in message ups.com...
Why use carbon and remove beneficial stuff as well as junk. Carbon in
most cases is not needed, and a water change is more beneficial
overall.

I use carbon to remove discoloration.

What "beneficial stuff" carbon removes in your opinion?

On Sep 15, 1:14 pm, "Pszemol" wrote:
"TSJ" wrote in oglegroups.com...
Why use carbon and remove beneficial stuff as well as junk. Carbon in
most cases is not needed, and a water change is more beneficial
overall.

I use carbon to remove discoloration.

What "beneficial stuff" carbon removes in your opinion?

There is mixed ideas with AC./ Lots depends on the type or quality of
the AC as well, but it does do good at removing discoloratin and odor.
I believe and its also been proven that even the b est AC becomes
ineffective in a marine environment in short order, like 1 or two days
depending on disolved organic load...........and its also been proven
that AC also does a great job of removing rtoo much in the way of
biominerals and other useful materials as well, as the unwanted
disolved organics. However with the short life span in a marine
environment, I have my doubts if it will overly remove too much since
its proven it does not last long. Now if your changing out AC every
day or two then yes it can overdo the good with the bad....and yes
there is folks who are obsessed with changing out AC every day or
two.

I assume you do not have a protein skimmer. I personally prefer to
rely on my protein skimmer and water changes and use of RODI water.
Its been years since I even bought any AC. Just my observations.

"TSJ" wrote in message ups.com...
There is mixed ideas with AC./ Lots depends on the type or quality of
the AC as well, but it does do good at removing discoloratin and odor.

Yes, it works very well at removing discoloation.
That is why I use it in my tank and see big difference
every time I change water...

If I do not use carbon, old water is yellow.
If I use carbon, old water is identical in color with fresh water.

Using carbon gives me water clarity and the best useage
of expensive lights over my tank. Yellowish colored water
filters out beneficial light waves and wastes light energy.

I believe and its also been proven that even the b est AC becomes
ineffective in a marine environment in short order, like 1 or two days
depending on disolved organic load...........and its also been proven
that AC also does a great job of removing rtoo much in the way of
biominerals and other useful materials as well, as the unwanted
disolved organics.

Can you name any of these beneficial biominerals whichs are
removed by the carbon?

Can you point me to the source where these two things are prooven?

However with the short life span in a marine
environment, I have my doubts if it will overly remove too much since
its proven it does not last long. Now if your changing out AC every
day or two then yes it can overdo the good with the bad....and yes
there is folks who are obsessed with changing out AC every day or
two.

I do not change carbon every day or two...
I kept it for the whole period between water changes.
This period varies with my lasyness from 3-4 weeks
to couple of months. Water stayed clear with carbon
even when carbon was there for months. This experience
tells me that carbon keeps working at removing discoloration
for weeks if not months.

I assume you do not have a protein skimmer.

Yes, I use small skimmer but it does not prevent water discoloration.

I personally prefer to
rely on my protein skimmer and water changes and use of RODI water.
Its been years since I even bought any AC. Just my observations.

Well, I am not going to tell you how to take care for your own tank,
but you can do one simple test for me during next water change.

Prepare two identical, empty, clean and white plastic buckets
(I use empty buckets from used up IO salt) and fill one with new,
freshly made sal****er. The second fill with water from your tank.
Then bring them close to each other and look down comparing
the water color. Tell me if your skimmer removed discoloration
as good as my carbon does... If the colors are IDENTICAL and
you cannot tell the difference which bucket contains fresh water
than I will agree with you that your skimmer works as good as carbon.
I am willing to bet that you will see the difference... it was obvious to me.

On Sep 15, 2:27 pm, "Pszemol" wrote:
"TSJ" wrote in oglegroups.com...
There is mixed ideas with AC./ Lots depends on the type or quality of
the AC as well, but it does do good at removing discoloratin and odor.

Yes, it works very well at removing discoloation.
That is why I use it in my tank and see big difference
every time I change water...

If I do not use carbon, old water is yellow.
If I use carbon, old water is identical in color with fresh water.

Using carbon gives me water clarity and the best useage
of expensive lights over my tank. Yellowish colored water
filters out beneficial light waves and wastes light energy.

I believe and its also been proven that even the b est AC becomes
ineffective in a marine environment in short order, like 1 or two days
depending on disolved organic load...........and its also been proven
that AC also does a great job of removing rtoo much in the way of
biominerals and other useful materials as well, as the unwanted
disolved organics.

Can you name any of these beneficial biominerals whichs are
removed by the carbon?

Can you point me to the source where these two things are prooven?

However with the short life span in a marine
environment, I have my doubts if it will overly remove too much since
its proven it does not last long. Now if your changing out AC every
day or two then yes it can overdo the good with the bad....and yes
there is folks who are obsessed with changing out AC every day or
two.

I do not change carbon every day or two...
I kept it for the whole period between water changes.
This period varies with my lasyness from 3-4 weeks
to couple of months. Water stayed clear with carbon
even when carbon was there for months. This experience
tells me that carbon keeps working at removing discoloration
for weeks if not months.

I assume you do not have a protein skimmer.

Yes, I use small skimmer but it does not prevent water discoloration.

I personally prefer to
rely on my protein skimmer and water changes and use of RODI water.
Its been years since I even bought any AC. Just my observations.

Well, I am not going to tell you how to take care for your own tank,
but you can do one simple test for me during next water change.

Prepare two identical, empty, clean and white plastic buckets
(I use empty buckets from used up IO salt) and fill one with new,
freshly made sal****er. The second fill with water from your tank.
Then bring them close to each other and look down comparing
the water color. Tell me if your skimmer removed discoloration
as good as my carbon does... If the colors are IDENTICAL and
you cannot tell the difference which bucket contains fresh water
than I will agree with you that your skimmer works as good as carbon.
I am willing to bet that you will see the difference... it was obvious to me.

The tanks I run skimmers on have very little if any at all
discoloration, but I do know what your talking about as its evident
when I change water on my unskimmed tanks. I run my skimmers on the
extreme dry side..and that tends to remove more organic material than
a wet skim, so I hear. As for where I got my info its all stuff I read
and heard of on various online websites and forums. At the one MACNA
Bob Fenner also stated the same basic stuff I posted earlier in
regards to carbon use. As to what minerals etc it removes, I guess it
can actually remove most any mineral since that what AC
does...........never really checked what it removes in regards to bio
minerals. I would have to think a lot depend so how much of a load is
on yur system as well as to how much proteins or doc is created and
needs to be removed..

"Pszemol" wrote in message
...
"TSJ" wrote in message
ups.com...
There is mixed ideas with AC./ Lots depends on the type or quality of
the AC as well, but it does do good at removing discoloratin and odor.

Yes, it works very well at removing discoloation.
That is why I use it in my tank and see big difference
every time I change water...

If I do not use carbon, old water is yellow.
If I use carbon, old water is identical in color with fresh water.

Using carbon gives me water clarity and the best useage
of expensive lights over my tank. Yellowish colored water
filters out beneficial light waves and wastes light energy.

I believe and its also been proven that even the b est AC becomes
ineffective in a marine environment in short order, like 1 or two days
depending on disolved organic load...........and its also been proven
that AC also does a great job of removing rtoo much in the way of
biominerals and other useful materials as well, as the unwanted
disolved organics.

Can you name any of these beneficial biominerals whichs are
removed by the carbon?

Can you point me to the source where these two things are prooven?

However with the short life span in a marine
environment, I have my doubts if it will overly remove too much since
its proven it does not last long. Now if your changing out AC every
day or two then yes it can overdo the good with the bad....and yes
there is folks who are obsessed with changing out AC every day or
two.

I do not change carbon every day or two...
I kept it for the whole period between water changes.
This period varies with my lasyness from 3-4 weeks
to couple of months. Water stayed clear with carbon
even when carbon was there for months. This experience
tells me that carbon keeps working at removing discoloration
for weeks if not months.

the pores of activated carbon tend to clog up, stopping the absorbtion. it
depends upon what you're absorbing and how much is there.

i have an oceanclear filter and put a bag in the middle of the pleated
filter. i've also used a very fine nylon door screen in between layers of
carbon and other filtering material to contain it.

regards,
charlie

"Pszemol" wrote in message ...
Other than hanging a bag filled with carbon in the sump,
what do you use to make carbon work more efficiently?

Tha idea with a bag works, but in my understanding
water would penetrate carbon better if it was flowing
forced through not around the bag...

I was trying to put a layer of carbon in the phosphate
reactor, but carbon is very light and it is easily
lifted up with water and travels back to my tank...

How do you put carbon to work in your reef tanks?

Now I have an idea... what if I dump the carbon loose
into the sock in the sump? The sock I am using is quite
fine to prevent carbon escaping to the sump and the
water is pretty well agitated in the sock so the carbon
will work efficiently there...
The sock lasts about a week or two before it clogs
with dirt, so I could dump the sock with used up carbon
to the garbagge and put new sock with new carbon portion.
Sounds like a good idea - have to test it :-)

On Sep 17, 12:58 pm, "Pszemol" wrote:
"Pszemol" wrote in ...
Other than hanging a bag filled with carbon in the sump,
what do you use to make carbon work more efficiently?

Tha idea with a bag works, but in my understanding
water would penetrate carbon better if it was flowing
forced through not around the bag...

I was trying to put a layer of carbon in the phosphate
reactor, but carbon is very light and it is easily
lifted up with water and travels back to my tank...

How do you put carbon to work in your reef tanks?

Now I have an idea... what if I dump the carbon loose
into the sock in the sump? The sock I am using is quite
fine to prevent carbon escaping to the sump and the
water is pretty well agitated in the sock so the carbon
will work efficiently there...
The sock lasts about a week or two before it clogs
with dirt, so I could dump the sock with used up carbon
to the garbagge and put new sock with new carbon portion.
Sounds like a good idea - have to test it :-)

Well it is a known fact that discoloration in the water will affect
the PAR rating. I also know that judicial use of a skimmer, helps but
it does not remove all and does not remove some things that AC
removes, but AC does remove iodine, which is needed. Fortunately
Iodine is easy to replenish in most cases just by typical foods that
fokls feed......I have heard that yellowish cast water can reduce PAR
by as much as 1/2 in some cases. Skimmers are more effective if run
wet, but in my case I prefer to run them on the dry side, and reduce
daily chores of cup emptying.

As charlie stated, AC can and does become clogged, and can get clogged
very quickly, and then it becomes exactly what a reef tank is not
looking for, a nitrate factory. Its aperfect place to propagate
nitrogen from.all that trapped fopod and proteins etc, good oxy....its
a given..nitrate producer then. Then you have the spectrum chanmge
when water contains nitrates..........odds are you'll never notice it
in water, or have anything to measure it, but nitrates in water also
affect proper spectrum and PAR as well.even if water appears to be
free of discoloration. So right off use of carbon can induce nitrate
into the tank, it can strip minerals and compounds like iodine and
strontium, it can also leech phospate intot he water as phosporic acid
is used toprocess and wash activated charcoal..so fokls that do not
worry about rinsing charcoal can very well be adding phosphates into
the tank unknowlingly. Over time it is possible to get to levels that
create algae problems especially if yuur charcoal is being replaced on
a fairly short and consistent time frame..while your trying to reduce
induciton of nitrate from clogged carbon media.

I know I have good water on all of my tanks, and little to no
discoloration and have never had a need to run carbon. Only real time
I have ever use dit was when I used Saliferts Flat worm
killer.........but then I found a "new prooduct" to erradicate
flatworms and it also does a number on Bristle worms, unfortunately,
and did not use charcoal since and my tanks have been just fine. (LFS
here is real bad with corals they sell, as they have flatworm
problems...........but that is a hole other topic)

Do you have a PAR meter? It would be interesting to get some numbers,
along with nitrate and phosophate readings, and compile it into a
graph type chart and see what effects one obtains with weekly vrs
monthly carbon changes and no carbon vrs carbon plus skim and no skim
etc etc.........Makes me wish I now pickedup that PAR meter at the
yard sale the other month.