Expandable foam question

How waterproof is that stuff? I'm putting in a stream and there are many
wide flat limestone rocks that I would like to incorporate, while using EPDM
liner for most of the stream. In particular, there is a rock about five
feet in diameter, about 4 inches thick that has a nice overhang. I would
like to dig the dirt back about a foot, lay liner back under the rock and
foam the seam where liner meets rock so I can have the stream flow over the
rock and fall to the pool below.

Will the foam be good enough to waterproof the seam so I can have standing
water there, or only enough to deflect splashing water with the water level
lower than the edge of the liner? Is there a better way to do this? I know
I can do the Gatorgard spray-in stuff, but that's on the pricey side of
things.

Here's what you do.

Place the liner.

Spray the foam onto the liner and then place the rock over the foam. It
won't be 100%, but pretty close. The foam works better this way than trying
to lay a "bead" of it afterwards.

FYI, This past weekend I reworked my stream a bit and tried the cheap stuff
from the home depot rather than the black stuff hawked by the pond industry.
Worked like a charm. Kind of ugly though. But others on this list seem
assured it will turn a less offensive color soon (If not I can always go
back to the black stuff later)

Joe


On 3/15/04 3:23 PM, "grubber" wrote:

How waterproof is that stuff? I'm putting in a stream and there are many
wide flat limestone rocks that I would like to incorporate, while using EPDM
liner for most of the stream. In particular, there is a rock about five
feet in diameter, about 4 inches thick that has a nice overhang. I would
like to dig the dirt back about a foot, lay liner back under the rock and
foam the seam where liner meets rock so I can have the stream flow over the
rock and fall to the pool below.

Will the foam be good enough to waterproof the seam so I can have standing
water there, or only enough to deflect splashing water with the water level
lower than the edge of the liner? Is there a better way to do this? I know
I can do the Gatorgard spray-in stuff, but that's on the pricey side of
things.



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Here's what you do.

Place the liner.

Spray the foam onto the liner and then place the rock over the foam. It
won't be 100%, but pretty close. The foam works better this way than trying
to lay a "bead" of it afterwards.

FYI, This past weekend I reworked my stream a bit and tried the cheap stuff
from the home depot rather than the black stuff hawked by the pond industry.
Worked like a charm. Kind of ugly though. But others on this list seem
assured it will turn a less offensive color soon (If not I can always go
back to the black stuff later)

Joe


On 3/15/04 3:23 PM, "grubber" wrote:

How waterproof is that stuff? I'm putting in a stream and there are many
wide flat limestone rocks that I would like to incorporate, while using EPDM
liner for most of the stream. In particular, there is a rock about five
feet in diameter, about 4 inches thick that has a nice overhang. I would
like to dig the dirt back about a foot, lay liner back under the rock and
foam the seam where liner meets rock so I can have the stream flow over the
rock and fall to the pool below.

Will the foam be good enough to waterproof the seam so I can have standing
water there, or only enough to deflect splashing water with the water level
lower than the edge of the liner? Is there a better way to do this? I know
I can do the Gatorgard spray-in stuff, but that's on the pricey side of
things.



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joe wrote:
Here's what you do.

Place the liner.

Spray the foam onto the liner and then place the rock over the foam. It
won't be 100%, but pretty close. The foam works better this way than trying
to lay a "bead" of it afterwards.

FYI, This past weekend I reworked my stream a bit and tried the cheap stuff
from the home depot rather than the black stuff hawked by the pond industry.
Worked like a charm. Kind of ugly though. But others on this list seem
assured it will turn a less offensive color soon (If not I can always go
back to the black stuff later)

Joe


On 3/15/04 3:23 PM, "grubber" wrote:


How waterproof is that stuff? I'm putting in a stream and there are many
wide flat limestone rocks that I would like to incorporate, while using EPDM
liner for most of the stream. In particular, there is a rock about five
feet in diameter, about 4 inches thick that has a nice overhang. I would
like to dig the dirt back about a foot, lay liner back under the rock and
foam the seam where liner meets rock so I can have the stream flow over the
rock and fall to the pool below.

Will the foam be good enough to waterproof the seam so I can have standing
water there, or only enough to deflect splashing water with the water level
lower than the edge of the liner? Is there a better way to do this? I know
I can do the Gatorgard spray-in stuff, but that's on the pricey side of
things.


And later on, if you develop a leak - check this place first.

The best thing to seal two pieces of liner together is the
expensive tape.
--
Bonnie
NJ

joe wrote:
Here's what you do.

Place the liner.

Spray the foam onto the liner and then place the rock over the foam. It
won't be 100%, but pretty close. The foam works better this way than trying
to lay a "bead" of it afterwards.

FYI, This past weekend I reworked my stream a bit and tried the cheap stuff
from the home depot rather than the black stuff hawked by the pond industry.
Worked like a charm. Kind of ugly though. But others on this list seem
assured it will turn a less offensive color soon (If not I can always go
back to the black stuff later)

Joe


On 3/15/04 3:23 PM, "grubber" wrote:


How waterproof is that stuff? I'm putting in a stream and there are many
wide flat limestone rocks that I would like to incorporate, while using EPDM
liner for most of the stream. In particular, there is a rock about five
feet in diameter, about 4 inches thick that has a nice overhang. I would
like to dig the dirt back about a foot, lay liner back under the rock and
foam the seam where liner meets rock so I can have the stream flow over the
rock and fall to the pool below.

Will the foam be good enough to waterproof the seam so I can have standing
water there, or only enough to deflect splashing water with the water level
lower than the edge of the liner? Is there a better way to do this? I know
I can do the Gatorgard spray-in stuff, but that's on the pricey side of
things.


And later on, if you develop a leak - check this place first.

The best thing to seal two pieces of liner together is the
expensive tape.
--
Bonnie
NJ

Thanks for all the replies.

But I'm not trying to seal liner together. I have a very large flat rock
that is mostly buried. The downslope edge hangs out a little over a 6"
drop. I want to dig back further under the rock to form a small pool under
the drop. The stream would flow over the rock, fall into the pool below and
then continue on its way. The pool would have a liner bottom.

My basic question is, "Is it possible to make a waterproof join between the
pool liner and the immovable rock, and if so, how?"

Thanks for all the replies.

But I'm not trying to seal liner together. I have a very large flat rock
that is mostly buried. The downslope edge hangs out a little over a 6"
drop. I want to dig back further under the rock to form a small pool under
the drop. The stream would flow over the rock, fall into the pool below and
then continue on its way. The pool would have a liner bottom.

My basic question is, "Is it possible to make a waterproof join between the
pool liner and the immovable rock, and if so, how?"

"grubber" wrote in message
...
Thanks for all the replies.

But I'm not trying to seal liner together. I have a very large flat rock
that is mostly buried. The downslope edge hangs out a little over a 6"
drop. I want to dig back further under the rock to form a small pool
under
the drop. The stream would flow over the rock, fall into the pool below
and
then continue on its way. The pool would have a liner bottom.

My basic question is, "Is it possible to make a waterproof join between
the
pool liner and the immovable rock, and if so, how?"

If I understand correctly, you can't move the rock so lifting it and placing
say some sealing tape under it, would not work. What I would do is place a
small strip of liner over the edge of the rock where it meets the liner, and
seal that. Or squirt foam into the crevace, trim and then fill.

BV.

"grubber" wrote in message
...
Thanks for all the replies.

But I'm not trying to seal liner together. I have a very large flat rock
that is mostly buried. The downslope edge hangs out a little over a 6"
drop. I want to dig back further under the rock to form a small pool
under
the drop. The stream would flow over the rock, fall into the pool below
and
then continue on its way. The pool would have a liner bottom.

My basic question is, "Is it possible to make a waterproof join between
the
pool liner and the immovable rock, and if so, how?"

If I understand correctly, you can't move the rock so lifting it and placing
say some sealing tape under it, would not work. What I would do is place a
small strip of liner over the edge of the rock where it meets the liner, and
seal that. Or squirt foam into the crevace, trim and then fill.

BV.

I wouldn't count on just the foam. It's supposedly something like 95%
water-blocking. My experience on a waterfall that cascades through three
pools with about 8' of drop substantiates this. In my case, the foam directs
MOST of the water over the falls, but not all of it.

As far as what WILL work, I have no experience with this, but they make
those fake-rock waterfalls waterproof using concrete (textured with a
rock-like pad), then painted with waterproofing, then painted. Maybe you
could bridge the gap that way. You'd still have a joint between concrete
and rock though.You can't jack the flat rock up, and slip liner underneath?


"grubber" wrote in message
news
How waterproof is that stuff? I'm putting in a stream and there are many
wide flat limestone rocks that I would like to incorporate, while using
EPDM
liner for most of the stream. In particular, there is a rock about five
feet in diameter, about 4 inches thick that has a nice overhang. I would
like to dig the dirt back about a foot, lay liner back under the rock and
foam the seam where liner meets rock so I can have the stream flow over
the
rock and fall to the pool below.

Will the foam be good enough to waterproof the seam so I can have standing
water there, or only enough to deflect splashing water with the water
level
lower than the edge of the liner? Is there a better way to do this? I
know
I can do the Gatorgard spray-in stuff, but that's on the pricey side of
things.