Still green...

In article , dkat
wrote:

UV's - none. I don't use them for a reason though I have a friend who had a
very small pond who used one and had crystal clear water. Her pond however
was in a deck (no silt runoff into the pond), was very shaded (that in
itself will keep the algae down) and was extremely small (maybe 3X3x1.5).
I'm not against UV, I just said that this pond has silt eroding into it and
needs more than a simple UV fix.

I agree the pond edge needs to be raised, but more for chemicals that
may be applied to that beautiful lawn and then commingle with the pond
water in heavy rain. I just don't think that that little soil border
is causing that much silt and I doubt much gets past the lawn.

This pic appears to be classic suspended algae:

http://www.thehvscene.com/pond/DSC02147.JPG

I like my almost 'natural' way of doing
things but that is what tickles my 'fancy'.

Lets be fair: you have a pump ? A mechanical filter (maybe) ? Would you
use meds ? How bout potash for all those water hyacinths of yours? Ever
drain your pond for a good cleaning ?

For years here, some posters here have singled out UVs for this
'natural' argument, I don't get it... what could be more unnatural than
an electric water pump ??? UV is a natural occurring action on all
ponds, natural or ornamental.

I'll start my campaign for venturi ozone at some point in the future :-)

jay
Wed May 26, 2004



I'm also extremely lazy,
overworked, underpaid, 5'2", 55 yrs, out of shape, etc... I don't have the
time, energy, muscle or patience to do what a lot of ponders here do. My
setup is extremely simple, relatively small (about 1000 gals at most) and
crystal clear most of the time with very, very, little work involved (I
throw food at the fish, add water when needed, watch the cats make fools of
themselves lusting after the fish). My biggest concern is my three
butterfly koi and my albino cat getting too big for the pond and not knowing
what to do other than build a bigger pond

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
In article , dkat
wrote:

UV's - none. I don't use them for a reason though I have a friend who
had a
very small pond who used one and had crystal clear water. Her pond
however
was in a deck (no silt runoff into the pond), was very shaded (that in
itself will keep the algae down) and was extremely small (maybe
3X3x1.5).
I'm not against UV, I just said that this pond has silt eroding into it
and
needs more than a simple UV fix.

I agree the pond edge needs to be raised, but more for chemicals that
may be applied to that beautiful lawn and then commingle with the pond
water in heavy rain. I just don't think that that little soil border
is causing that much silt and I doubt much gets past the lawn.

This pic appears to be classic suspended algae:

http://www.thehvscene.com/pond/DSC02147.JPG


Look at the leaves of the waterlily and the horizonal sides of the liner.
Both have a layer of silt. The silt will also add nutrients that make the
algae flourish. Other pictures looked much more 'muddied' from silt than
algae but I agree on the picture you are showing it looks like spring algae
growth that I get before the hyacinth has been put into my upper pond and
taken over. If they use UV, I assume they will have to filter before the
UV. Is that the case? That is where in there current system would they put
the UV?


I like my almost 'natural' way of doing
things but that is what tickles my 'fancy'.

Lets be fair: you have a pump ? A mechanical filter (maybe) ? Would you
use meds ? How bout potash for all those water hyacinths of yours? Ever
drain your pond for a good cleaning ?

This is why I said "almost 'natural'"

I have a pump to move the water up to the veggie filter. The pump
(waterfall pump that takes large particles) sits in a bucket with lava rocks
to serve as a bio filter. I don't clean out the pond (though when wading
through it to move rocks or plants I will scoop out leaves if they are under
foot and feel slippery... I don't use meds or potash. I did try dunking my
hyacinths in Miracle grow when I first started my pond thinking 'what could
it hurt'... killed them dead. As I said, I'm lazy - really, really lazy.
And now that I think of it I'm also cheap - really, really cheap. And again
I don't have anything negative to say about UVs. I simply posted what
works for me and is inexpensive and easy. Many far more competent people
here use UV as well as incredibly impressive filters, piping, drain systems,
etc.

And what is venturi ozone?

For years here, some posters here have singled out UVs for this
'natural' argument, I don't get it... what could be more unnatural than
an electric water pump ??? UV is a natural occurring action on all
ponds, natural or ornamental.

I'll start my campaign for venturi ozone at some point in the future :-)

jay
Wed May 26, 2004



I'm also extremely lazy,
overworked, underpaid, 5'2", 55 yrs, out of shape, etc... I don't have
the
time, energy, muscle or patience to do what a lot of ponders here do.
My
setup is extremely simple, relatively small (about 1000 gals at most)
and
crystal clear most of the time with very, very, little work involved (I
throw food at the fish, add water when needed, watch the cats make fools
of
themselves lusting after the fish). My biggest concern is my three
butterfly koi and my albino cat getting too big for the pond and not
knowing
what to do other than build a bigger pond

In article , dkat
wrote:

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
In article , dkat
wrote:

UV's - none. I don't use them for a reason though I have a friend who
had a
very small pond who used one and had crystal clear water. Her pond
however
was in a deck (no silt runoff into the pond), was very shaded (that in
itself will keep the algae down) and was extremely small (maybe
3X3x1.5).
I'm not against UV, I just said that this pond has silt eroding into it
and
needs more than a simple UV fix.

I agree the pond edge needs to be raised, but more for chemicals that
may be applied to that beautiful lawn and then commingle with the pond
water in heavy rain. I just don't think that that little soil border
is causing that much silt and I doubt much gets past the lawn.

This pic appears to be classic suspended algae:

http://www.thehvscene.com/pond/DSC02147.JPG


Look at the leaves of the waterlily and the horizonal sides of the liner.
Both have a layer of silt. The silt will also add nutrients that make the
algae flourish. Other pictures looked much more 'muddied' from silt than
algae but I agree on the picture you are showing it looks like spring algae
growth that I get before the hyacinth has been put into my upper pond and
taken over. If they use UV, I assume they will have to filter before the
UV. Is that the case? That is where in there current system would they put
the UV?

The less turbid the water is the more efficient, so after any
mechanical filtration is better. As for the OP situation, I don't have
enough details from those pics.


I like my almost 'natural' way of doing
things but that is what tickles my 'fancy'.

Lets be fair: you have a pump ? A mechanical filter (maybe) ? Would you
use meds ? How bout potash for all those water hyacinths of yours? Ever
drain your pond for a good cleaning ?

This is why I said "almost 'natural'"

I have a pump to move the water up to the veggie filter. The pump
(waterfall pump that takes large particles) sits in a bucket with lava rocks
to serve as a bio filter. I don't clean out the pond (though when wading
through it to move rocks or plants I will scoop out leaves if they are under
foot and feel slippery... I don't use meds or potash.

So you let natural selection work its magic... herons, raccoons ?


I did try dunking my
hyacinths in Miracle grow when I first started my pond thinking 'what could
it hurt'... killed them dead. As I said, I'm lazy - really, really lazy.
And now that I think of it I'm also cheap - really, really cheap. And again
I don't have anything negative to say about UVs. I simply posted what
works for me and is inexpensive and easy. Many far more competent people
here use UV as well as incredibly impressive filters, piping, drain systems,
etc.

And what is venturi ozone?

Straight ozone injected from a venturi fitting. Great for organic
detritus.

jay
Wed May 26, 2004



For years here, some posters here have singled out UVs for this
'natural' argument, I don't get it... what could be more unnatural than
an electric water pump ??? UV is a natural occurring action on all
ponds, natural or ornamental.

I'll start my campaign for venturi ozone at some point in the future :-)

jay
Wed May 26, 2004



I'm also extremely lazy,
overworked, underpaid, 5'2", 55 yrs, out of shape, etc... I don't have
the
time, energy, muscle or patience to do what a lot of ponders here do.
My
setup is extremely simple, relatively small (about 1000 gals at most)
and
crystal clear most of the time with very, very, little work involved (I
throw food at the fish, add water when needed, watch the cats make fools
of
themselves lusting after the fish). My biggest concern is my three
butterfly koi and my albino cat getting too big for the pond and not
knowing
what to do other than build a bigger pond

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
snip
For years here, some posters here have singled out UVs for this
'natural' argument, I don't get it... what could be more unnatural than
an electric water pump ??? UV is a natural occurring action on all
ponds, natural or ornamental.
snip

I'll bite on this one, but first let me say I am not against UV. I think UV
clarifiers have a place in ponds, when desired. Hell, I've thought of
putting one in, but I prefer the more natural method of letting the pond
establish balance. Yes, my pond takes longer to clear then my neighbors with
UV, but mine is clearing because I get a balance of going and the pond
begins "to take care of itself" so to speak. I like the sense of that. I dug
a hole, I threw some water in, and now the critters are coming to roost.

BV.

Something I forgot to mention... While the UV may give beautifully 'non pea
soup' water it does nothing to eliminate the wastes from fish/animals/etc.
That is another reason I am so happy with my veggie filter. So even if you
do go the UV route I still think there is more than one reason for a veggie
filter (removing silt and toxins). By the by, my lone little hyacinth is
already clearing things up (put it in this last Sunday).

It is cold and rainy here but the fish think it is feeding time.....


"Benign Vanilla" wrote in message
...

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
snip
For years here, some posters here have singled out UVs for this
'natural' argument, I don't get it... what could be more unnatural than
an electric water pump ??? UV is a natural occurring action on all
ponds, natural or ornamental.
snip

I'll bite on this one, but first let me say I am not against UV. I think
UV
clarifiers have a place in ponds, when desired. Hell, I've thought of
putting one in, but I prefer the more natural method of letting the pond
establish balance. Yes, my pond takes longer to clear then my neighbors
with
UV, but mine is clearing because I get a balance of going and the pond
begins "to take care of itself" so to speak. I like the sense of that. I
dug
a hole, I threw some water in, and now the critters are coming to roost.

BV.

"dkat" wrote in message
. net...
Something I forgot to mention... While the UV may give beautifully 'non
pea
soup' water it does nothing to eliminate the wastes from fish/animals/etc.
That is another reason I am so happy with my veggie filter. So even if you
do go the UV route I still think there is more than one reason for a
veggie
filter (removing silt and toxins). By the by, my lone little hyacinth is
already clearing things up (put it in this last Sunday).
snip

YES!!! Very important point. UV clarifiers are NOT filters. If anything they
just contribute to the bioload of the pond.

BV.

In article , Benign Vanilla
wrote:

"dkat" wrote in message
. net...
Something I forgot to mention... While the UV may give beautifully 'non
pea
soup' water it does nothing to eliminate the wastes from fish/animals/etc.
That is another reason I am so happy with my veggie filter. So even if you
do go the UV route I still think there is more than one reason for a
veggie
filter (removing silt and toxins). By the by, my lone little hyacinth is
already clearing things up (put it in this last Sunday).
snip

YES!!! Very important point. UV clarifiers are NOT filters. If anything they
just contribute to the bioload of the pond.

Hows that. I can think of few things that deposit more bio-load than a
pond full of suspended algae. When it is finally staved of a food
source and dies away, it settles to the bottom of your pond... it is
not, for the most part, consumed by your veggie filters. A sand filter,
however can pull it from the pond.

UV light inhibits the algae from reproducing, that is cutting the
bio-load.

jay
Thu May 27, 2004




BV.

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
In article , Benign Vanilla
wrote:

"dkat" wrote in message
. net...
Something I forgot to mention... While the UV may give beautifully
'non
pea
soup' water it does nothing to eliminate the wastes from
fish/animals/etc.
That is another reason I am so happy with my veggie filter. So even if
you
do go the UV route I still think there is more than one reason for a
veggie
filter (removing silt and toxins). By the by, my lone little hyacinth
is
already clearing things up (put it in this last Sunday).
snip

YES!!! Very important point. UV clarifiers are NOT filters. If anything
they
just contribute to the bioload of the pond.

Hows that. I can think of few things that deposit more bio-load than a
pond full of suspended algae. When it is finally staved of a food
source and dies away, it settles to the bottom of your pond... it is
not, for the most part, consumed by your veggie filters. A sand filter,
however can pull it from the pond.

UV light inhibits the algae from reproducing, that is cutting the
bio-load.

My point is that UV clarifiers kill algae that pass through them. Dead algae
can become food for hungry live algae. I am not saying UV is bad, don't get
me wrong. I am not saying that. I am just saying that UV clarifiers do not
filter the water, they kill things in the water, and then let the things
move right on through. Filtration to me, IMHO, is the removal of a from b.
UV just kills a and leaves it in B. UV is a supplemental tool, not a
replacement for filtration.

BV.

In article , Benign Vanilla
wrote:

"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
In article , Benign Vanilla
wrote:

"dkat" wrote in message
. net...
Something I forgot to mention... While the UV may give beautifully
'non
pea
soup' water it does nothing to eliminate the wastes from
fish/animals/etc.
That is another reason I am so happy with my veggie filter. So even if
you
do go the UV route I still think there is more than one reason for a
veggie
filter (removing silt and toxins). By the by, my lone little hyacinth
is
already clearing things up (put it in this last Sunday).
snip

YES!!! Very important point. UV clarifiers are NOT filters. If anything
they
just contribute to the bioload of the pond.

Hows that. I can think of few things that deposit more bio-load than a
pond full of suspended algae. When it is finally staved of a food
source and dies away, it settles to the bottom of your pond... it is
not, for the most part, consumed by your veggie filters. A sand filter,
however can pull it from the pond.

UV light inhibits the algae from reproducing, that is cutting the
bio-load.

My point is that UV clarifiers kill algae that pass through them. Dead algae
can become food for hungry live algae. I am not saying UV is bad, don't get
me wrong. I am not saying that. I am just saying that UV clarifiers do not
filter the water, they kill things in the water, and then let the things
move right on through. Filtration to me, IMHO, is the removal of a from b.
UV just kills a and leaves it in B. UV is a supplemental tool, not a
replacement for filtration.

Sure, but that is exactly what I have always maintained.

Heck, I start my WH in a hothouse in Feb and they are thriving in ponds
by the 3rd week in Apr.. But I always try to incorporate a sand filter
to my ponds. I've just completed a 5K gal one and I'm using 1k lbs of
#16 silica in two filters. The 120 watts of UV that I will use on this
one... is only to lessen the burden on the sand filters (read: me
opening them and that mess)... cause there isn't a suspended algae out
there that can get past 1K of #16 sand.

jay
Thu May 27, 2004




BV.

"Benign Vanilla" wrote in
:


"Go Fig" wrote in message
...
In article , Benign Vanilla
wrote:

"dkat" wrote in message
. net...
Something I forgot to mention... While the UV may give
beautifully 'non pea soup' water it does nothing to eliminate the
wastes from fish/animals/etc. That is another reason I am so happy
with my veggie filter. So even if you do go the UV route I still
think there is more than one reason for a veggie filter (removing
silt and toxins). By the by, my lone little hyacinth is already
clearing things up (put it in this last Sunday).
snip

YES!!! Very important point. UV clarifiers are NOT filters. If
anything they just contribute to the bioload of the pond.

Hows that. I can think of few things that deposit more bio-load than
a pond full of suspended algae. When it is finally staved of a food
source and dies away, it settles to the bottom of your pond... it is
not, for the most part, consumed by your veggie filters. A sand
filter, however can pull it from the pond.

UV light inhibits the algae from reproducing, that is cutting the
bio-load.

My point is that UV clarifiers kill algae that pass through them. Dead
algae can become food for hungry live algae. I am not saying UV is bad,
don't get me wrong. I am not saying that. I am just saying that UV
clarifiers do not filter the water, they kill things in the water, and
then let the things move right on through. Filtration to me, IMHO, is
the removal of a from b. UV just kills a and leaves it in B. UV is a
supplemental tool, not a replacement for filtration.

BV.



I have to agree w/ Jay on this one...

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