New Tank Still Struggling??

wrote:

snip

I noticed my Filter (Whisper Power 30) overflowing from the 'Wonder
Tube Chamber', indicating the need to change the filter (according to
the manual). I purchased a new filter, did a partial water change
(20%) and added 2 new fish (1 Swordtail, 1 Molly).

Over the last few days, I've been checking my levels and have not seen
any unusual spikes in Ammonia or Nitrites or Nitrates, yet by this
morning, the two new fish I just purchased were dead (after 4 days).

My guess...You cleaned your filter and almost doubled the fish load at
the same time. The new fish were stressed - possibly new arrivals at
the fish store - and the ammonia at high pH was enough to put them over
the edge.

It's not unusual for new purchases to die within the first few days, and
livebearers can be surprisingly fragile.

--
Put the word aquaria in the subject to reply.
Did you read the FAQ? http://faq.thekrib.com

On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 12:23:50 -0600, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:


wrote in message
roups.com...
I'll continue monitoring my levels to see if the Ammonia keeps rising.
The first one that died yesterday was probably dead in the tank for at
least half of the day when I was at work. The second for not very
long.
====================
I hope you're not bringing them home and putting them into your tank without
acclimating them to your water conditions. We used to call that PH shock
but more is involved that others can better explain. There is one store
that has a PH of 6.6 to 6.8 and their water is very soft. If I just add
fish from there to my Quarantine tank (everything gets quarantined here)
with it's high alkalinity, hardness and PH of 7.8, I am almost guaranteed to
lose most of them.

I operate on the assumption, and we all know what they say about
assuming, that everyone who posts here has read The FAQs at The Krib.
And for those who haven't, well, head on over there.

http://faq.thekrib.com/begin.html


-- Mister Gardener

On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 14:18:29 -0500, "Nikki"
wrote:

as you are getting them used to your water, do you put water from your tank
into their bag?
that's what I do, but I'm sure not long enough, but I have not lost fish
from it yet, then again me an the fish store are probably using the same
water she is only five min from me, anyway how long do you wait before
putting them in your tank?

Do not assume the store water is the same as yours. It may have
originated from the same source, but it has been used and altered in
many different ways than your own and the parameters may be much
different. I've gotten into the habit of keeping the store water out
of my tanks. I have a great big white plastic measuring cup, it holds
at least a half gallon, I use it to mix muffin or cake batter. Well, I
used to use it for that. Now it's fish only. I float my bag of fish in
the aquarium for about 10 minutes to equalize the temperature. Then I
put a cup of my tank water in the big bowl, open the bag and pour the
fish and water from the pet shop into that bowl. I sit the bowl on top
of the aquarium glass top by the light, which helps keep the
temperature up. I lay a piece of newspaper over the cup, so the fish
are essentially in the dark. I add a cup of water from my aquarium
about every 15 minutes. When the fish in the bowl water is more tank
water than store water, I take the measuring cup mixing bowl to the
kitchen and, over a larger bowl I pour the fish and water through my
net and take the fish and net to the aquarium where they are released.
I believe that acclimating them in a dimly lit, quiet area is less
stressful than being trapped in a clear plastic bag in a tank with all
sorts of strangers looking in. The big bowl below is to catch any fish
I might spill in the pouring, but so far that hasn't happened yet. At
one of the pet stores I visit on occasion, the entire staff is trained
to say "don't put our water in your tank" right along with thank you
and have a great day. And, of course, they offer to teach acclimation.
It's become like a mantra for me, and on those rare occasions when I
think I'm about to cheat, I feel guilty and sinful.

-- Mister Gardener

"Nikki" wrote in message
...
koi
as you are getting them used to your water, do you put water from your
tank into their bag?

No Kikki, what I do is slowly pour them into a clear gallon container that's
shaped like a plastic milk jug and discard the bag. I carefully pour most of
the water they were in down the drain, leaving their backs covered. I then
add about 1/4 to 1/3 cup of water from the Q-tank into the container about
every 15 to 20 minutes or so. I also have an air bubbler running for them
in the container. But it works without the bubbler just as well. I keep
adding more and more water until they're in about 80% Q-tank water - then
gently move them to the Q-tank. This can take several hours but it's well
worth the effort and time.

that's what I do, but I'm sure not long enough, but I have not lost fish
from it yet, then again me an the fish store are probably using the same
water she is only five min from me, anyway how long do you wait before
putting them in your tank?

It depends on how long it takes me to get the water in the container to
about 80% or so of what's in the Q-tank. I am seldom exact about anything
but medications. ;-) It also depends on where I bought them. That one
store in Nashville has such soft acid water it can take 4 or more hours to
acclimate them, so I seldom buy fish there anymore. The other two stores
have water closer to what I have so it takes no more than maybe 2 hours.
Sometimes I forget to add more water for 30 minutes so that adds time... to
the fishes benefit. But I don't get any "gaspers" anymore who turn up dead
in anything from hours to days.

just wondering?
have you ever spilled the bag with fish in it while trying to do it, I
hate those stupid bags,

No, since I remove them from the bag and put them in the container as soon
as I get home. Also, I don't putz around when I buy fish - I go STRAIGHT
HOME with them. As for such accidents.... yes, I just did that recently
with some of my own fish I was putting outside in a 780g pool. The water
outside is a little different that what's in my tanks so wanted to acclimate
them for at least 20 to 30 minutes (there was also a temperature
difference) - and dropped the whole bucket into the pool! AAARGGGHHH!!!!
They hid in the plants for a few days but where fine. :-))) My Shubunkins
are pretty tough customers. I did kill some perarlscales the time I got
home late and had no time to acclimate them. We had some place to go and I
was really pressed for time. Instead of putting them in a tub to acclimate
them with a bubbler until we got back - I just put them in the Q-tank. BIG
MISTAKE. Half were dead in less than a week. :*(

I got some little guppies for my sons tank he wants
something with his ADF, and as I was putting the water in the bag from his
tank, over it went, fish were all over my kitchen counter, my six year old
did not think it was funny, but my two older ones "teenagers" of course
were laughing so hard, I'm trying to get them to help me catch them and
they had to leave the room they were laughing so hard,

LOL!!! That's teenagers for ya! :-D

anyway not the first time I
have done that to some innocent fish, they should put something at the
bottom of the bags so they sit up right when you take the band off.

I remove the band and turn the bag upside-down holding the top shut and let
most of the water pour off down the drain (I have a drain "strainer" thing
to catch any fish I may drop). Be careful. Then still holding the bag
upside-down I put it gently into the acclimation container. Then slowly
release the top and the fish sort of gently pour out into the container. I
discard the bag and start adding the water from the Q-tank. No more fish
dying at the surface gasping........
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

Mr. Gardener wrote:
I've gotten into the habit of keeping the store water out
of my tanks. I have a great big white plastic measuring cup ...

Boy, folks sure have complicated ways of acclimatizing fish .

I float the bag 10 minutes, then dump the fish into a net over a bucket.
The netted fish go into the aquarium and the store water stays out. So
far, so good.

"Mr. Gardener" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 12:23:50 -0600, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:
I hope you're not bringing them home and putting them into your tank
without
acclimating them to your water conditions. We used to call that PH shock
but more is involved that others can better explain. There is one store
that has a PH of 6.6 to 6.8 and their water is very soft. If I just add
fish from there to my Quarantine tank (everything gets quarantined here)
with it's high alkalinity, hardness and PH of 7.8, I am almost guaranteed
to
lose most of them.

I operate on the assumption, and we all know what they say about
assuming, that everyone who posts here has read The FAQs at The Krib.
And for those who haven't, well, head on over there.

http://faq.thekrib.com/begin.html
=============================
More specifically:
http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-addfish.html#acclimation
--
Koi-Lo.... frugal ponding since 1995...
Aquariums since 1952
My Pond & Aquarium Pages:
http://tinyurl.com/9do58
~~~ }((((o ~~~ }{{{{o ~~~ }(((((o

Jlen wrote,
I purchased a new filter, did a partial water change (20%) and added 2 new fish..........

I would never change 100% of the bio-media within the filter - and I
would never add fish at the same time...
Hard to tell the cause of the new fish dying; most likely osmotic
pressure shock, could have been stress shock, but not ammonia or
nitrite poisoning. Ammonia or nitrite poisoning only takes from a few
mins. to a few hours, not days to kill a fish. Besides, it would have
killed the other fish in the tank also!
If you selected healthy fish from the store, the only other reason for
the fish to die is poor acclimation............ Frank

On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:56:08 -0500, netDenizen wrote:

Mr. Gardener wrote:
I've gotten into the habit of keeping the store water out
of my tanks. I have a great big white plastic measuring cup ...

Boy, folks sure have complicated ways of acclimatizing fish .

I float the bag 10 minutes, then dump the fish into a net over a bucket.
The netted fish go into the aquarium and the store water stays out. So
far, so good.

I used to do that, years ago. But my current lfs has such wildly
different water quality from my own, he's very hard and alkaline, I'm
very soft and acid, that I have dragged out my acclimation exercises
to a much more gradual transition. I've read that it is more difficult
for a fish to go from hard water to soft than it is to go from soft to
hard. I don't know if it's true, but taking my time doesn't hurt.

-- Mister Gardener

On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 19:21:27 -0600, "Koi-Lo"
wrote:

http://faq.thekrib.com/begin.html
=============================
More specifically:
http://faq.thekrib.com/begin-addfish.html#acclimation

I think we all need to begin at the beginning.

-- Mister Gardener

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 07:53:53 -0500, Mr. Gardener
wrote:

On Thu, 23 Mar 2006 18:56:08 -0500, netDenizen wrote:

Mr. Gardener wrote:
I've gotten into the habit of keeping the store water out
of my tanks. I have a great big white plastic measuring cup ...

Boy, folks sure have complicated ways of acclimatizing fish .

I float the bag 10 minutes, then dump the fish into a net over a bucket.
The netted fish go into the aquarium and the store water stays out. So
far, so good.

In the past, I had no qualms about dumping the store water into my
tank with the fish. The distant pass. I knew then that it was not a
good practice. Nowadays my lfs drops little tablets in the bag that
turn the water blue. Oxygen tablets, he says. Whatever he calls them,
blue water still calls up memories of methylene blue and sick tanks
and I know I don't want that stuff in my tank even if it is good
oxygen. So his blue water essentially forces me to stick to the rules
when adding fish to my tank.

-- Mister Gardener