Read lots on how to start planted tank but still confused - please help

Ok, I've had a few aquariums for over a year now, so I think I'm ready
to start my first planted tank. I've been reading everything I can
get my hands on and have asked questions at the LFS, but now I'm
overloaded with info.

I have the following plans on how to start but I need your input so
that I know I'm on the right track. I have a 25 gallon tall tank -
12" x 24" x 16"

I figure I'll start with a mixture of flourite and black gravel about
2-3 inches high. I want to use sand but I've heard conflicting
commentary that sea sand will throw things off and the sand I have in
my ciclid tank is designed for African ciclids so that LFS said I
shouldn't use it for live plants.

I was going to start with a small CO2 canister that they LFS suggested
(retails there for about $35 - don't remember the name) and a dual
flourescent light hood. The room the tank will be in does not have a
lot of stron ambient light so most of the light will come from the
hood.

I still need to research plants, but I'm thinking that I'm best going
with plants with low to medium light requirements. I haven't even
though abotu fish yet - although I know it'll be a community tank.

What else do I need? What should I fix?

|| Ok, I've had a few aquariums for over a year now, so I think I'm
|| ready to start my first planted tank. I've been reading everything
|| I can get my hands on and have asked questions at the LFS, but now
|| I'm overloaded with info.

Then this is the best place you could be...

|| I have the following plans on how to start but I need your input so
|| that I know I'm on the right track. I have a 25 gallon tall tank -
|| 12" x 24" x 16"
||
|| I figure I'll start with a mixture of flourite and black gravel about
|| 2-3 inches high. I want to use sand but I've heard conflicting
|| commentary that sea sand will throw things off and the sand I have in
|| my ciclid tank is designed for African ciclids so that LFS said I
|| shouldn't use it for live plants.

Sand is ok, but it's tricky... Should only use sand after you've mastered
the uses of substrate, and understand all that could go wrong with sand....
Suggestion would be to wait until you've learned a bit more 'about sand'....

|| I was going to start with a small CO2 canister that they LFS
|| suggested (retails there for about $35 - don't remember the name)
|| and a dual flourescent light hood. The room the tank will be in
|| does not have a lot of stron ambient light so most of the light will
|| come from the hood.

Is this a pressurized co2, or the yeast water mixture?

For lights, start with 1.5WPG, figured by total watts divided by gallons.

|| I still need to research plants, but I'm thinking that I'm best going
|| with plants with low to medium light requirements. I haven't even
|| though abotu fish yet - although I know it'll be a community tank.
||
|| What else do I need? What should I fix?

From there, start out with some low light plants, java ferns, anubias,
crypts, and your success rate will climb...

--
RedForeman ©® future fabricator and creator of a ratbike
streetfighter!!! ==========================
2003 TRX450ES
1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
'98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
==========================
ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø


is that better??

On 26 May 2004 18:27:50 -0700, (Sarah)
wrote:

|| I have the following plans on how to start but I need your input so
|| that I know I'm on the right track. I have a 25 gallon tall tank -
|| 12" x 24" x 16"
||
|| I figure I'll start with a mixture of flourite and black gravel about
|| 2-3 inches high.

Skip the black gravel. It has no nutritional value for the plants.


On Thu, 27 May 2004 "RedForeman ©®" wrote:

For lights, start with 1.5WPG, figured by total watts divided by gallons.

Or 2 wpg since it's a deep tank.


From there, start out with some low light plants, java ferns, anubias,
crypts, and your success rate will climb...

I'll add to the list. Ambulia, sword plants, valisneria, watersprite,
anacharis, pennywort, maybe even tiger lotus.

How long do you plan on keeping the lights on per day? Which bulbs did you
choose for your new planted tank?

"Sarah" wrote in message
om...
Ok, I've had a few aquariums for over a year now, so I think I'm ready
to start my first planted tank. I've been reading everything I can
get my hands on and have asked questions at the LFS, but now I'm
overloaded with info.

I have the following plans on how to start but I need your input so
that I know I'm on the right track. I have a 25 gallon tall tank -
12" x 24" x 16"

I figure I'll start with a mixture of flourite and black gravel about
2-3 inches high. I want to use sand but I've heard conflicting
commentary that sea sand will throw things off and the sand I have in
my ciclid tank is designed for African ciclids so that LFS said I
shouldn't use it for live plants.

I was going to start with a small CO2 canister that they LFS suggested
(retails there for about $35 - don't remember the name) and a dual
flourescent light hood. The room the tank will be in does not have a
lot of stron ambient light so most of the light will come from the
hood.

I still need to research plants, but I'm thinking that I'm best going
with plants with low to medium light requirements. I haven't even
though abotu fish yet - although I know it'll be a community tank.

What else do I need? What should I fix?

Ok, I'm going to change up my situation a bit. I recently (two days
ago) aquired a 55 gallon tank. The tank dimensions are 48"x18"x21".
I have the choice of several filters. The tank came with a Eheim 2217
and a HOB filter (bio-wheel). I also have a brand new Eheim 2028 that
I can use in place of one of the filters. I'm thinking that two
eheims on one tank is a bit more filtration that I really need. :-P

I still plan on using a flourite and gravel mix - although probably
not black. I would like to have about a 4" layer in the back and only
gravel up front in the clear areas - about 1/2" to 3/4".

I'll be buying compact Flourescent lights. I hope to find bulbs that
will give me at least 3wpg. I figure I'll put the lights on a timer
and have them on about 14 hours per day.

I still have a problem with getting CO2. I have found several
commercially produced CO2 thingies but the ones I've found - including
the one from Hagen are only rated up to 20 gallons. How do I add CO2
reliablely to this tank with shelling out a whole lot of money?

-Sarah


"Phil Williamson" wrote in message ...
How long do you plan on keeping the lights on per day? Which bulbs did you
choose for your new planted tank?

"Sarah" wrote in message
om...
Ok, I've had a few aquariums for over a year now, so I think I'm ready
to start my first planted tank. I've been reading everything I can
get my hands on and have asked questions at the LFS, but now I'm
overloaded with info.

I have the following plans on how to start but I need your input so
that I know I'm on the right track. I have a 25 gallon tall tank -
12" x 24" x 16"

I figure I'll start with a mixture of flourite and black gravel about
2-3 inches high. I want to use sand but I've heard conflicting
commentary that sea sand will throw things off and the sand I have in
my ciclid tank is designed for African ciclids so that LFS said I
shouldn't use it for live plants.

I was going to start with a small CO2 canister that they LFS suggested
(retails there for about $35 - don't remember the name) and a dual
flourescent light hood. The room the tank will be in does not have a
lot of stron ambient light so most of the light will come from the
hood.

I still need to research plants, but I'm thinking that I'm best going
with plants with low to medium light requirements. I haven't even
though abotu fish yet - although I know it'll be a community tank.

What else do I need? What should I fix?

"Sarah" wrote in message
om...
Ok, I'm going to change up my situation a bit. I recently (two days
ago) aquired a 55 gallon tank. The tank dimensions are 48"x18"x21".
I have the choice of several filters. The tank came with a Eheim 2217
and a HOB filter (bio-wheel). I also have a brand new Eheim 2028 that
I can use in place of one of the filters. I'm thinking that two
eheims on one tank is a bit more filtration that I really need. :-P

uh, yup, especially with CO2 injection (which you don't want to
dissipate, and CO2 = lots of plants which are filters, and lots of plants
= smaller fish which means less biological load).

I still plan on using a flourite and gravel mix - although probably
not black. I would like to have about a 4" layer in the back and only
gravel up front in the clear areas - about 1/2" to 3/4".

Sounds right, though with CO2, you can get more ambitious and go for 100%
ground cover. I have a 135g at work which is 99% covered (a little spot
under the Tiger Lotus gets too much shade and the Anubius are *slowly*
moving in there). If you go this route (perhaps trying some Echin.
tennelus across the front) then your slope is not as critical (slope for
cosmetics rather than for detritus settling), and you want to go a bit
deeper in the front (1-1/2") and not neccesarily so deep in the back
(3-1/2"?). Really, for cosmetics, tiering is better than sloping, but
that requires more intense terraforming than you might be interested in.

I used a mix of Crypts across the front of the 135g and I have mixed
feelings about it. It's too well established for me to be in a hurry
about moving them, but it looks more like a field of weeds than a lawn of
tall grass. Be careful what you plant where, as you can become a victim
of success easily ;~)

I'll be buying compact Flourescent lights. I hope to find bulbs that
will give me at least 3wpg. I figure I'll put the lights on a timer
and have them on about 14 hours per day.

The wpg is in the ballpark, but 14 daily might be high to start with.
This is something you experiment with. I'm certainly not any kind of an
expert at this. I just know enough to have fun and be dangerous ;~)

I still have a problem with getting CO2. I have found several
commercially produced CO2 thingies but the ones I've found - including
the one from Hagen are only rated up to 20 gallons. How do I add CO2
reliablely to this tank with shelling out a whole lot of money?

Don't let the rating phase you too much. The rate the CO2 dissapates is
as important as the rate it goes in. If you don't use the bio-wheel, and
keep your Eheim flow pointed downwards, you will reduce the rate at which
the CO2 dissipates (getting more bang for your buck). This improves the
results from a single DIY canister (Hagen thingy or otherwise). The
advantage of using two units (another possibility) is that you can have
them on alternate cycles (they are never both off at the same time). How
much CO2 you need to inject really depends on your expectations. I get
tired of pruning plants, so I tend to go lower, especially after the
plants are established. As they say - ymmv )
--
www.NetMax.tk

-Sarah


"Phil Williamson" wrote in message
...
How long do you plan on keeping the lights on per day? Which bulbs
did you
choose for your new planted tank?

"Sarah" wrote in message
om...
Ok, I've had a few aquariums for over a year now, so I think I'm
ready
to start my first planted tank. I've been reading everything I can
get my hands on and have asked questions at the LFS, but now I'm
overloaded with info.

I have the following plans on how to start but I need your input so
that I know I'm on the right track. I have a 25 gallon tall tank -
12" x 24" x 16"

I figure I'll start with a mixture of flourite and black gravel
about
2-3 inches high. I want to use sand but I've heard conflicting
commentary that sea sand will throw things off and the sand I have
in
my ciclid tank is designed for African ciclids so that LFS said I
shouldn't use it for live plants.

I was going to start with a small CO2 canister that they LFS
suggested
(retails there for about $35 - don't remember the name) and a dual
flourescent light hood. The room the tank will be in does not have
a
lot of stron ambient light so most of the light will come from the
hood.

I still need to research plants, but I'm thinking that I'm best
going
with plants with low to medium light requirements. I haven't even
though abotu fish yet - although I know it'll be a community tank.

What else do I need? What should I fix?

I still have a problem with getting CO2. I have found several
commercially produced CO2 thingies but the ones I've found - including
the one from Hagen are only rated up to 20 gallons. How do I add CO2
reliablely to this tank with shelling out a whole lot of money?


WOrk on the basis that any additional CO2 you can add is good...even if its
just a little bit. I use a Hagen thing on one of my tanks (about 50USG) & of
course it doesn't raise the concentration significantly but it does make a
discernable difference. If you want more, use 2.

I.

Sounds like you actually have a 75 gallon rather than a 55. Four 55w
CFs would give you a nice amount of light, but very close to too much
for a non-pressurized CO2 setup. I would aim slightly lower if you
plan to use DIY CO2. But still, if you have the patience to keep up
with them, a couple DIY CO2 bottles will work for you. I wouldn't
waste any money on off-the-shelf DIY CO2, they are no better than
regular DIY yeast/sugar mixes, save the money for a pressurized setup.
As for the lighting, again probably a little too long, I'd start with
10-12 hours and see how things go, you may find yourself reducing it
if you run into any problems. Filter wise, the 2217 is what I use on
both 55 and 90 gallon tanks so I know that will work very well for
you. The 2028 is just as good, pretty much the same size, a little
bigger media storage I believe but very much the same. The HOB you can
throw out the window, it's only going to reduce your CO2 levels and
it's not needed as any one of the other filters you have is more than
sufficient. A good size fish load may also help maintain higher CO2
levels, but obviously don't go overboard. As for the substrate,
flourite/gravel mix works well, I'd add a handfull of peat moss to the
lowest layer along with 5-6 crushed Flourish Tabs. Then cap it all
with 3-4 inches of flourite/gravel mix. I don't think you'll be able
to maintain such a steep slope for too long (4" in back, 1/2-3/4" in
front) plus that could cause nutrients to come out of the lower layers
of the substrate. I'd go with 4" in the back and 3" in front, all the
same gravel/flourite mix in case you decide you want some foreground
plants in the future.

Here's some basic info regarding DIY CO2 setups:
http://www.gpodio.com/diy_co2.asp

Hope that helps
Giancarlo Podio

I've found several vendors on Ebay that will sell me a CO2 regulator,
a pH meter, some funky black thing whose name I forget to regulate
bubbles. The bundle comes out to about $250. I'll willing to spend
that money. My question is - where do I get CO2 tanks. I'm an EMT, I
know where to get O2. But where does an aquarist get CO2?

Also, my water has a high pH (about 7.6-7.8). I know adding CO2
lowers pH which would be good for the tank. I'm now sure what my gH
and Kh are. Would using a peat layer underneath my gravel be
beneficial?

Sarah


(Giancarlo Podio) wrote in message om...
Sounds like you actually have a 75 gallon rather than a 55. Four 55w
CFs would give you a nice amount of light, but very close to too much
for a non-pressurized CO2 setup. I would aim slightly lower if you
plan to use DIY CO2. But still, if you have the patience to keep up
with them, a couple DIY CO2 bottles will work for you. I wouldn't
waste any money on off-the-shelf DIY CO2, they are no better than
regular DIY yeast/sugar mixes, save the money for a pressurized setup.
As for the lighting, again probably a little too long, I'd start with
10-12 hours and see how things go, you may find yourself reducing it
if you run into any problems. Filter wise, the 2217 is what I use on
both 55 and 90 gallon tanks so I know that will work very well for
you. The 2028 is just as good, pretty much the same size, a little
bigger media storage I believe but very much the same. The HOB you can
throw out the window, it's only going to reduce your CO2 levels and
it's not needed as any one of the other filters you have is more than
sufficient. A good size fish load may also help maintain higher CO2
levels, but obviously don't go overboard. As for the substrate,
flourite/gravel mix works well, I'd add a handfull of peat moss to the
lowest layer along with 5-6 crushed Flourish Tabs. Then cap it all
with 3-4 inches of flourite/gravel mix. I don't think you'll be able
to maintain such a steep slope for too long (4" in back, 1/2-3/4" in
front) plus that could cause nutrients to come out of the lower layers
of the substrate. I'd go with 4" in the back and 3" in front, all the
same gravel/flourite mix in case you decide you want some foreground
plants in the future.

Here's some basic info regarding DIY CO2 setups:
http://www.gpodio.com/diy_co2.asp

Hope that helps
Giancarlo Podio

|| I've found several vendors on Ebay that will sell me a CO2 regulator,
|| a pH meter, some funky black thing whose name I forget to regulate
|| bubbles. The bundle comes out to about $250. I'll willing to spend
|| that money. My question is - where do I get CO2 tanks. I'm an EMT,
|| I
|| know where to get O2. But where does an aquarist get CO2?
||
|| Also, my water has a high pH (about 7.6-7.8). I know adding CO2
|| lowers pH which would be good for the tank. I'm now sure what my gH
|| and Kh are. Would using a peat layer underneath my gravel be
|| beneficial?
||
|| Sarah

Home brewery supply houses, makers of beer, etc... Welding supply company
can sell you tanks too

If you live in a big town, grab the yellow pages, and look for gas
companies, propane companies, etc.. that's where I get mine filled.

--
RedForeman ©® fabricator and creator of the ratbike streetfighter!!!
==========================
2003 TRX450ES
1992 TRX-350 XX (For Sale)
'98 Tacoma Ext Cab 4X4 Lifted....
==========================
ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø,¸¸¸,ø¤° `°¤ø,¸¸,ø¤°`°¤ø
((((º`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸.·´¯`·...¸((((º ·´¯`·.¸. , . .·´¯`·.. ((((º

is that better??