Filtration Question

Yes, charcoal is technically a chemical filter. Not everyone uses charcoal
either.
A biological filter is a necessity for an aquarium. There are many
different types (bio-wheels, filter pad, canister, undergravel, etc.) The
principle point of a biofilter is to use nitro-bacteria to convert the toxic
compounds of ammonia and nitrite to the non-toxic nitrate.

Check out information on the Nitrogen cycle for aquariums or information
about "cycling" you tank.

Justin

"robbins876" wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a charcoal filter that that came with my 10 gallon tank
starter-kit. I've been reading up on biological filtration. Am I
correct in the fact that charcoal filters are not the same as bio
filters? Since I don't have a bio filter, how imperative is it that I
get one? IS charcoal just a chemical filter?

Thanks,
Rob

I have a charcoal filter that that came with my 10 gallon tank
starter-kit. I've been reading up on biological filtration. Am I
correct in the fact that charcoal filters are not the same as bio
filters? Since I don't have a bio filter, how imperative is it that I
get one? IS charcoal just a chemical filter?

Thanks,
Rob

"robbins876" wrote in message
oups.com...
I have a charcoal filter that that came with my 10 gallon tank
starter-kit. I've been reading up on biological filtration. Am I
correct in the fact that charcoal filters are not the same as bio
filters?

Yes. Charcoal is chemical filtration, partly a mechanical filter as well,
dependent on the size of the charcoal.

Since I don't have a bio filter, how imperative is it that I
get one? IS charcoal just a chemical filter?

Charcoal is used for removing chemical toxins in the water. It will not act
as a biological filter. What you you should aim for to have biological
filtration, which is where are all of your good bacteria will live, is
remove the carbon and replace it with plain old, cheap filter floss or
sponge. Then your tank will have to go through an establishing cycle, which
could be stressful for some or all or your current fish, so you need to read
up on that before you venture into it.

Try these links for some infomative information:

http://www.2cah.com/netmax/basics/water/water.shtml
http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/doc...t/nitcyc.shtml

They should give you some ideas about what and how to change the filter's
media over and the pitfalls of not doing it patiently or properly.

Is this filter air driven by any chance? One of those little green cartridge
types with carbon at the top and foam in the bottom half? If so, I'd remove
it and replace it with a small sponge filter.

Oz

--
My Aquatic web Blog is at http://members.optusnet.com.au/ivan.smith

Well two people have told you that yes charcoal is a chemical filter
and no it isn't a bio filter. What they haven't told you is that yes it
is a bio filter (indirectly). Just like everything else in your tank.
Nitrifying bacteria are going to grow everywhere whether you ask them
to or not, and as it happens carbon tends to have a large surface area
and be prime spawning grounds for that bacteria.

You don't need to get another filter, the one you have will be fine as
long as you don't overstock your tank. In fact I use cheap hang on the
tank carbon filters almost exclusively in my planted tanks. I put the
carbon in the floss bag at the startup of the tank to help the tank get
through that rocky cycling period and then I just never change the
charcoal. Bacteria grow in the filter and the charcoal gets used up and
eventually leaches stuff back into the aquarium but by then my plants
are established and ready to eat it up.

Even if you don't intend to have a planted tank this filter will
probably be completely adequate for a ten gallon tank. If you want to
be sure then buy a test kit for ammonia and nitrates and keep an eye on
the two of them. If you don't like what you see then add another filter
- but I seriously doubt it will make any difference. Even with no
filtration there is usually enough bacteria growing in the substrate of
a ten gallon tank to completely nitrify any ammonia and as long as your
ammonia reading is zero adding extra biological filters isn't going to
accomplish anything.


-Daniel

Can i also point out that this person HAS overstocked his tank
" just got my first 10 gallon aquarium last Wednesday (5 days ago). I
let the water set-up for 24 hours before putting my two fantail
goldfish and one black moor in the tank"

as noted by his previous post?
"dfreas" wrote in message
ps.com...
Well two people have told you that yes charcoal is a chemical filter
and no it isn't a bio filter. What they haven't told you is that yes it
is a bio filter (indirectly). Just like everything else in your tank.
Nitrifying bacteria are going to grow everywhere whether you ask them
to or not, and as it happens carbon tends to have a large surface area
and be prime spawning grounds for that bacteria.

You don't need to get another filter, the one you have will be fine as
long as you don't overstock your tank. In fact I use cheap hang on the
tank carbon filters almost exclusively in my planted tanks. I put the
carbon in the floss bag at the startup of the tank to help the tank get
through that rocky cycling period and then I just never change the
charcoal. Bacteria grow in the filter and the charcoal gets used up and
eventually leaches stuff back into the aquarium but by then my plants
are established and ready to eat it up.

Even if you don't intend to have a planted tank this filter will
probably be completely adequate for a ten gallon tank. If you want to
be sure then buy a test kit for ammonia and nitrates and keep an eye on
the two of them. If you don't like what you see then add another filter
- but I seriously doubt it will make any difference. Even with no
filtration there is usually enough bacteria growing in the substrate of
a ten gallon tank to completely nitrify any ammonia and as long as your
ammonia reading is zero adding extra biological filters isn't going to
accomplish anything.


-Daniel

On 21 Mar 2005 14:26:03 -0800, "robbins876"
wrote:

I have a charcoal filter that that came with my 10 gallon tank
starter-kit. I've been reading up on biological filtration. Am I
correct in the fact that charcoal filters are not the same as bio
filters? Since I don't have a bio filter, how imperative is it that I
get one? IS charcoal just a chemical filter?

Thanks,
Rob

Hi Rob,

I can't imagine what you are going to do with all the differing
opinions you are getting. The very fact that there are so many ideas
led me to remove the charcoal from my 5 tanks about 6 months ago. I
had noticed that I could never clean the filter media well enough to
get good flow through for the water. I experimented by removing the
charcoal and then washing the bags and was pleased to find it was the
charcoal that was holding the flow and wouldn't clean out.

My 75 gallon tank has two Penguin 330s, thus 4 bio wheels. I got
tired of the things not rotating. I learned all the things to get
them to rotate again, but was having to repeat the procedures more
than I wanted. Then I realized that my other 4 tanks did not have bio
wheels, but were keeping the water clean, so I removed the wheels
several months ago.

In my own opinion only, I think the filter mainly holds the waste
material until it solids break down to a size that can pass through
the media back into the tank. Some bacteria action probably takes
place why being held, but I believe the primary bacteria activity
takes place in the tank.

I have live plants in all my tanks, so I cannot speak for conditions
without live plants. I do regularly change 20% of the water twice
weekly.

I like to keep things as simple as possible and have found no need to
make any chemical adjustments to the tap water. I find my simple
routine is easier to do, thus fewer excuses to not do the water
changes. I love excuses. I don't clean the filter media until most
of the water is flowing around the media.

dick

"anemone" wrote in message ...
Can i also point out that this person HAS overstocked his tank
" just got my first 10 gallon aquarium last Wednesday (5 days ago). I
let the water set-up for 24 hours before putting my two fantail
goldfish and one black moor in the tank"

as noted by his previous post?

I'd say that he has to be extra diligent about the chemical conditions in his tank, as the smaller volume leaves him less time to
react to an adverse event that could occur (e.g. Ammonia spike during cycling, etc.)

If he can GUARANTEE clean, fresh water in his 10 gallon tank with 3 goldfish (e.g. via frequent partial water changes), what other
problem do you see in his current setup?

The Fish Stores have a higher goldfish density than that in their tanks. But they have a constant supply of clean/fresh water.

yeah...they do have a constant supply of fresh water.....and they don't keep
the same goldfish for years either....
"Gfishery" wrote in message
...

"anemone" wrote in message
...
Can i also point out that this person HAS overstocked his tank
" just got my first 10 gallon aquarium last Wednesday (5 days ago). I
let the water set-up for 24 hours before putting my two fantail
goldfish and one black moor in the tank"

as noted by his previous post?

I'd say that he has to be extra diligent about the chemical conditions in
his tank, as the smaller volume leaves him less time to
react to an adverse event that could occur (e.g. Ammonia spike during
cycling, etc.)

If he can GUARANTEE clean, fresh water in his 10 gallon tank with 3
goldfish (e.g. via frequent partial water changes), what other
problem do you see in his current setup?

The Fish Stores have a higher goldfish density than that in their tanks.
But they have a constant supply of clean/fresh water.

Another problem with the setup is that he will stunt the fishs' growth.
Goldfish have the potential to grow 10+ inches.....If their growth is
stunted, internal organs can get deformed, such as the swim bladder, which
means unhappy fish an unecessary hassle later on.....
"Gfishery" wrote in message
...

"anemone" wrote in message
...
Can i also point out that this person HAS overstocked his tank
" just got my first 10 gallon aquarium last Wednesday (5 days ago). I
let the water set-up for 24 hours before putting my two fantail
goldfish and one black moor in the tank"

as noted by his previous post?

I'd say that he has to be extra diligent about the chemical conditions in
his tank, as the smaller volume leaves him less time to
react to an adverse event that could occur (e.g. Ammonia spike during
cycling, etc.)

If he can GUARANTEE clean, fresh water in his 10 gallon tank with 3
goldfish (e.g. via frequent partial water changes), what other
problem do you see in his current setup?

The Fish Stores have a higher goldfish density than that in their tanks.
But they have a constant supply of clean/fresh water.

Right. Whatever. My first aquarium was a ten gallon tank from walmart
that I stuck a lionhead goldfish, two black moors, and a pl*co in. I
never had any problems and I checked the water quality practically
daily. 3 goldfish does not make this tank overstocked. 6 months from
now it may be overstocked but I'd be willing to bet that after six
months he'll have either discovered he doesn't like this hobby and have
gotten rid of his fish or decide he loves the hobby and buy another
tank.

It seems like practically everyone around here is always jumping on
every new person that wanders in about how overstocked their new tank
is. Overstocked is an extremely relative term. I have a 20 gallon
aquarium with about 35 inches worth of fish in it plus clams, snails
and shrimp - it always has less than 10ppm nitrates. Is it overstocked?
No.

The only way to tell if an aquarium is overstocked is to watch the fish
and see if they are comfortable and have enough swimming room and then
test the water to make sure it's healthy. If you can't do that (which
no one here can) then you can't say if the tank is overstocked or not.
The only time we should ever accuse someone of having an overstocked
tank is when they come in here saying "I have 50 fish in my new ten
gallon tank and they keep dying...whats wrong!?!?"

-Daniel