Changing Filtration in established tank.

I've been thinking of changing the filtration in my 75 gallon FOWLR tank to
the Berlin method. Water tests indicate my tank has 0 ppm ammonia and
nitrite. However, Nitrate hovers around 40 ppm. To maintain nitrates at
that level requires I change 20 - 30 gallons of water per month.

Currently I use Under Gravel Filtration as the primary biological filter. A
medium sized canister filter is also used, but is used for chemical (active
carbon) filtration only. In an effort to reduce nitrates, I installed a
Aqua C Remora protein skimmer. However, it only produces 1/4 inch of waste
in the collection cup every 2 - 3 days. I think this is due to the
efficiency of my UnderGravel filter.

Given my setup (live stock is listed below), should I switch to the Berlin
method? If so, what is the best way to switch over to the Berlin Method? I
was thinking about turning the UG filter off. The protein skimmer and live
rock/sand would be the primary source of water filtration. The protein
skimmer might skim enough waste from the water along with the live rock
filtration, to support my live stock. I would then remove the UG filter,
replace the crushed coral with 1" of live sand(For the Wrasse). If
necessary, I could add some more live or base rock.

Live Stock:
1 - Dragon Wrasse
1 - Yellow Tang
1 - Coral Beauty
1 - Bi-Color Damsel
1 - Yellow Tail Blue Damsel
6 - Hermit Crabs
85 lbs of live rock. ( 1/2 of it was originally Base rock a year ago)
Many Baby Sand Sifter Star Fish.
Many Tube Worms
Some Sponges Growing on the Live Rock.

Thanks,
Glenn

Hey Glenn,
Are the elevated Nitrates causing any problems? If your tank is
looking good and everything is thriving I would leave it as it is.
Doing 20-30 gallon per month water change is not that usual, I read
and personally do 25% water change per month and you are doing 25-30%.
From experience if you turn your undergravel off you will want to
remove it as soon as you can. You will not believe the crap that is
under it. When I removed mine (55gal hex) I took out all the rock and
live stock. Next I saved as much of the tank water as possible and
threw out everything else. After taking the UG filter I cleaned the
entire tank, carefully added the new live sand, rocks and original
water I had saved. It was a lot of work but it was worth it and the
tank looked much better.
But like i said if everything is looking good, and the nitrates are
not causing any problems you may want to hold off on the hassle.

Ken D


Glenn Serpas wrote in message om...
I've been thinking of changing the filtration in my 75 gallon FOWLR tank to
the Berlin method. Water tests indicate my tank has 0 ppm ammonia and
nitrite. However, Nitrate hovers around 40 ppm. To maintain nitrates at
that level requires I change 20 - 30 gallons of water per month.

Currently I use Under Gravel Filtration as the primary biological filter. A
medium sized canister filter is also used, but is used for chemical (active
carbon) filtration only. In an effort to reduce nitrates, I installed a
Aqua C Remora protein skimmer. However, it only produces 1/4 inch of waste
in the collection cup every 2 - 3 days. I think this is due to the
efficiency of my UnderGravel filter.

Given my setup (live stock is listed below), should I switch to the Berlin
method? If so, what is the best way to switch over to the Berlin Method? I
was thinking about turning the UG filter off. The protein skimmer and live
rock/sand would be the primary source of water filtration. The protein
skimmer might skim enough waste from the water along with the live rock
filtration, to support my live stock. I would then remove the UG filter,
replace the crushed coral with 1" of live sand(For the Wrasse). If
necessary, I could add some more live or base rock.

Live Stock:
1 - Dragon Wrasse
1 - Yellow Tang
1 - Coral Beauty
1 - Bi-Color Damsel
1 - Yellow Tail Blue Damsel
6 - Hermit Crabs
85 lbs of live rock. ( 1/2 of it was originally Base rock a year ago)
Many Baby Sand Sifter Star Fish.
Many Tube Worms
Some Sponges Growing on the Live Rock.

Thanks,
Glenn

Ken wrote:

Hey Glenn,
Are the elevated Nitrates causing any problems? If your tank is
looking good and everything is thriving I would leave it as it is.
Doing 20-30 gallon per month water change is not that usual, I read
and personally do 25% water change per month and you are doing 25-30%.
From experience if you turn your undergravel off you will want to
remove it as soon as you can. You will not believe the crap that is
under it. When I removed mine (55gal hex) I took out all the rock and
live stock. Next I saved as much of the tank water as possible and
threw out everything else. After taking the UG filter I cleaned the
entire tank, carefully added the new live sand, rocks and original
water I had saved. It was a lot of work but it was worth it and the
tank looked much better.
But like i said if everything is looking good, and the nitrates are
not causing any problems you may want to hold off on the hassle.

Ken D


Glenn Serpas wrote in message
om...
I've been thinking of changing the filtration in my 75 gallon FOWLR tank
to the Berlin method. Water tests indicate my tank has 0 ppm ammonia and
nitrite. However, Nitrate hovers around 40 ppm. To maintain nitrates at
that level requires I change 20 - 30 gallons of water per month.

Currently I use Under Gravel Filtration as the primary biological filter.
A medium sized canister filter is also used, but is used for chemical
(active carbon) filtration only. In an effort to reduce nitrates, I
installed a Aqua C Remora protein skimmer. However, it only produces 1/4
inch of waste in the collection cup every 2 - 3 days. I think this is due
to the efficiency of my UnderGravel filter.

Given my setup (live stock is listed below), should I switch to the
Berlin method? If so, what is the best way to switch over to the Berlin
Method? I was thinking about turning the UG filter off. The protein
skimmer and live rock/sand would be the primary source of water
filtration. The protein skimmer might skim enough waste from the water
along with the live rock
filtration, to support my live stock. I would then remove the UG filter,
replace the crushed coral with 1" of live sand(For the Wrasse). If
necessary, I could add some more live or base rock.

Live Stock:
1 - Dragon Wrasse
1 - Yellow Tang
1 - Coral Beauty
1 - Bi-Color Damsel
1 - Yellow Tail Blue Damsel
6 - Hermit Crabs
85 lbs of live rock. ( 1/2 of it was originally Base rock a year ago)
Many Baby Sand Sifter Star Fish.
Many Tube Worms
Some Sponges Growing on the Live Rock.

Thanks,
Glenn

Thanks for the reply Ken.

The nitrates are not causing problems with my fish. However, I'm
hoping to add a few corals too. Besides, it's almost time to change out
some of the crushed coral. I've had the current substrate for 2.5
years(Fortunately, north Texas has 8.0PH water from the tap). Another big
reason for wanting to change, is how much better tanks look with sand
instead of crushed coral.

When you made your change, how many fish did you have? Did you return them
to the tank as soon as everything settled, or did you have to cycle all
over again? I have no where else to keep mine, besides a trash can and some
rubber containers.

Thanks again..
Glenn

Glenn, i heard that UG filters work great for reef systems at first then
they eventually break down, given this i would assume it better that you
changed it out before it broke down. my personal experience is UG sucks.
detritus settles under the grids and doesnt get sucked back up the tubes and
can become toxic to the tank in many forms. ie..organic, nitrate, biosludge,
etc..

what i like is the pure sugarfine marine sand, it looks much better than
aragonite sand, and still alot better than sugarfine mixed with aragonite.
This stuff is pure white and one manufacturer of this sand is Natures Ocean.
Of course this is just my opinion but looks can be everything.

also, you said that you will add the sand for your wrasse and more rocks,
just wanted to make sure that you knew if you add 2-3 inches or more of sand
on the bottom then the sand will filter more than your rocks and you wont
need to worry about the rocks filtering more than 25 percent of the load and
can choose your rock with different reasoning(liek aesthetics) than if you
needed it as filter rock.
wolfhedd

"Glenn Serpas" wrote in message
m...
Ken wrote:

Hey Glenn,
Are the elevated Nitrates causing any problems? If your tank is
looking good and everything is thriving I would leave it as it is.
Doing 20-30 gallon per month water change is not that usual, I read
and personally do 25% water change per month and you are doing 25-30%.
From experience if you turn your undergravel off you will want to
remove it as soon as you can. You will not believe the crap that is
under it. When I removed mine (55gal hex) I took out all the rock and
live stock. Next I saved as much of the tank water as possible and
threw out everything else. After taking the UG filter I cleaned the
entire tank, carefully added the new live sand, rocks and original
water I had saved. It was a lot of work but it was worth it and the
tank looked much better.
But like i said if everything is looking good, and the nitrates are
not causing any problems you may want to hold off on the hassle.

Ken D


Glenn Serpas wrote in message
om...
I've been thinking of changing the filtration in my 75 gallon FOWLR
tank
to the Berlin method. Water tests indicate my tank has 0 ppm ammonia
and
nitrite. However, Nitrate hovers around 40 ppm. To maintain nitrates at
that level requires I change 20 - 30 gallons of water per month.

Currently I use Under Gravel Filtration as the primary biological
filter.
A medium sized canister filter is also used, but is used for chemical
(active carbon) filtration only. In an effort to reduce nitrates, I
installed a Aqua C Remora protein skimmer. However, it only produces
1/4
inch of waste in the collection cup every 2 - 3 days. I think this is
due
to the efficiency of my UnderGravel filter.

Given my setup (live stock is listed below), should I switch to the
Berlin method? If so, what is the best way to switch over to the Berlin
Method? I was thinking about turning the UG filter off. The protein
skimmer and live rock/sand would be the primary source of water
filtration. The protein skimmer might skim enough waste from the water
along with the live rock
filtration, to support my live stock. I would then remove the UG
filter,
replace the crushed coral with 1" of live sand(For the Wrasse). If
necessary, I could add some more live or base rock.

Live Stock:
1 - Dragon Wrasse
1 - Yellow Tang
1 - Coral Beauty
1 - Bi-Color Damsel
1 - Yellow Tail Blue Damsel
6 - Hermit Crabs
85 lbs of live rock. ( 1/2 of it was originally Base rock a year ago)
Many Baby Sand Sifter Star Fish.
Many Tube Worms
Some Sponges Growing on the Live Rock.

Thanks,
Glenn

Thanks for the reply Ken.

The nitrates are not causing problems with my fish. However, I'm
hoping to add a few corals too. Besides, it's almost time to change out
some of the crushed coral. I've had the current substrate for 2.5
years(Fortunately, north Texas has 8.0PH water from the tap). Another big
reason for wanting to change, is how much better tanks look with sand
instead of crushed coral.

When you made your change, how many fish did you have? Did you return them
to the tank as soon as everything settled, or did you have to cycle all
over again? I have no where else to keep mine, besides a trash can and
some
rubber containers.

Thanks again..
Glenn

Hey Glenn, I had a foxface, maroon clown, and coral beauty at the time
along with some inverts and soft and lps corals (frogspawn).
I agree with you that the tank will look much better once you made the
switch, and if you are thinking of adding corals then you are right to
change it out now.
When I did mine I had purchased live sand from the internet whcih
settled very quickly so I was able to add my fish in back in. I think
it also helped to retain as much of the water as I could. Like you I
did not have anywhere else to put them so i had to return everything
to the tank right away.
Everything survived the change but I had a slight red slime outbreak
after. Because I also upgraded by lights Im not sure whcih change
caued the problem but it didnt take long to clear up. It was alot of
work but I got everything done in one day and after it was all over
and the tank stabilized it looked a lot nicer.

Ken D



Glenn Serpas wrote in message om...
Ken wrote:

Hey Glenn,
Are the elevated Nitrates causing any problems? If your tank is
looking good and everything is thriving I would leave it as it is.
Doing 20-30 gallon per month water change is not that usual, I read
and personally do 25% water change per month and you are doing 25-30%.
From experience if you turn your undergravel off you will want to
remove it as soon as you can. You will not believe the crap that is
under it. When I removed mine (55gal hex) I took out all the rock and
live stock. Next I saved as much of the tank water as possible and
threw out everything else. After taking the UG filter I cleaned the
entire tank, carefully added the new live sand, rocks and original
water I had saved. It was a lot of work but it was worth it and the
tank looked much better.
But like i said if everything is looking good, and the nitrates are
not causing any problems you may want to hold off on the hassle.

Ken D


Glenn Serpas wrote in message
om...
I've been thinking of changing the filtration in my 75 gallon FOWLR tank
to the Berlin method. Water tests indicate my tank has 0 ppm ammonia and
nitrite. However, Nitrate hovers around 40 ppm. To maintain nitrates at
that level requires I change 20 - 30 gallons of water per month.

Currently I use Under Gravel Filtration as the primary biological filter.
A medium sized canister filter is also used, but is used for chemical
(active carbon) filtration only. In an effort to reduce nitrates, I
installed a Aqua C Remora protein skimmer. However, it only produces 1/4
inch of waste in the collection cup every 2 - 3 days. I think this is due
to the efficiency of my UnderGravel filter.

Given my setup (live stock is listed below), should I switch to the
Berlin method? If so, what is the best way to switch over to the Berlin
Method? I was thinking about turning the UG filter off. The protein
skimmer and live rock/sand would be the primary source of water
filtration. The protein skimmer might skim enough waste from the water
along with the live rock
filtration, to support my live stock. I would then remove the UG filter,
replace the crushed coral with 1" of live sand(For the Wrasse). If
necessary, I could add some more live or base rock.

Live Stock:
1 - Dragon Wrasse
1 - Yellow Tang
1 - Coral Beauty
1 - Bi-Color Damsel
1 - Yellow Tail Blue Damsel
6 - Hermit Crabs
85 lbs of live rock. ( 1/2 of it was originally Base rock a year ago)
Many Baby Sand Sifter Star Fish.
Many Tube Worms
Some Sponges Growing on the Live Rock.

Thanks,
Glenn

Thanks for the reply Ken.

The nitrates are not causing problems with my fish. However, I'm
hoping to add a few corals too. Besides, it's almost time to change out
some of the crushed coral. I've had the current substrate for 2.5
years(Fortunately, north Texas has 8.0PH water from the tap). Another big
reason for wanting to change, is how much better tanks look with sand
instead of crushed coral.

When you made your change, how many fish did you have? Did you return them
to the tank as soon as everything settled, or did you have to cycle all
over again? I have no where else to keep mine, besides a trash can and some
rubber containers.

Thanks again..
Glenn

i didnt remove my fish, always got used to them in the clouded water, they
dont seem to take too badly to it. wolfhedd

"Ken" wrote in message
om...
Hey Glenn, I had a foxface, maroon clown, and coral beauty at the time
along with some inverts and soft and lps corals (frogspawn).
I agree with you that the tank will look much better once you made the
switch, and if you are thinking of adding corals then you are right to
change it out now.
When I did mine I had purchased live sand from the internet whcih
settled very quickly so I was able to add my fish in back in. I think
it also helped to retain as much of the water as I could. Like you I
did not have anywhere else to put them so i had to return everything
to the tank right away.
Everything survived the change but I had a slight red slime outbreak
after. Because I also upgraded by lights Im not sure whcih change
caued the problem but it didnt take long to clear up. It was alot of
work but I got everything done in one day and after it was all over
and the tank stabilized it looked a lot nicer.

Ken D



Glenn Serpas wrote in message
om...
Ken wrote:

Hey Glenn,
Are the elevated Nitrates causing any problems? If your tank is
looking good and everything is thriving I would leave it as it is.
Doing 20-30 gallon per month water change is not that usual, I read
and personally do 25% water change per month and you are doing 25-30%.
From experience if you turn your undergravel off you will want to
remove it as soon as you can. You will not believe the crap that is
under it. When I removed mine (55gal hex) I took out all the rock and
live stock. Next I saved as much of the tank water as possible and
threw out everything else. After taking the UG filter I cleaned the
entire tank, carefully added the new live sand, rocks and original
water I had saved. It was a lot of work but it was worth it and the
tank looked much better.
But like i said if everything is looking good, and the nitrates are
not causing any problems you may want to hold off on the hassle.

Ken D


Glenn Serpas wrote in message
om...
I've been thinking of changing the filtration in my 75 gallon FOWLR
tank
to the Berlin method. Water tests indicate my tank has 0 ppm ammonia
and
nitrite. However, Nitrate hovers around 40 ppm. To maintain nitrates
at
that level requires I change 20 - 30 gallons of water per month.

Currently I use Under Gravel Filtration as the primary biological
filter.
A medium sized canister filter is also used, but is used for chemical
(active carbon) filtration only. In an effort to reduce nitrates, I
installed a Aqua C Remora protein skimmer. However, it only produces
1/4
inch of waste in the collection cup every 2 - 3 days. I think this is
due
to the efficiency of my UnderGravel filter.

Given my setup (live stock is listed below), should I switch to the
Berlin method? If so, what is the best way to switch over to the
Berlin
Method? I was thinking about turning the UG filter off. The protein
skimmer and live rock/sand would be the primary source of water
filtration. The protein skimmer might skim enough waste from the
water
along with the live rock
filtration, to support my live stock. I would then remove the UG
filter,
replace the crushed coral with 1" of live sand(For the Wrasse). If
necessary, I could add some more live or base rock.

Live Stock:
1 - Dragon Wrasse
1 - Yellow Tang
1 - Coral Beauty
1 - Bi-Color Damsel
1 - Yellow Tail Blue Damsel
6 - Hermit Crabs
85 lbs of live rock. ( 1/2 of it was originally Base rock a year ago)
Many Baby Sand Sifter Star Fish.
Many Tube Worms
Some Sponges Growing on the Live Rock.

Thanks,
Glenn

Thanks for the reply Ken.

The nitrates are not causing problems with my fish. However, I'm
hoping to add a few corals too. Besides, it's almost time to change out
some of the crushed coral. I've had the current substrate for 2.5
years(Fortunately, north Texas has 8.0PH water from the tap). Another
big
reason for wanting to change, is how much better tanks look with sand
instead of crushed coral.

When you made your change, how many fish did you have? Did you return
them
to the tank as soon as everything settled, or did you have to cycle all
over again? I have no where else to keep mine, besides a trash can and
some
rubber containers.

Thanks again..
Glenn